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Author Topic: Dilemma
dragonman97

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Icon 1 posted December 25, 2006 13:58      Profile for dragonman97   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Relationships are a huge drain on both time and money, so I agree that they do need to be balanced with other goals.
That...or just take the really easy route, and don't have a relationship! [Razz]

Instant ROI!

1. Don't date.
2. ???
3. Profit?!

Now, admittedly, there are some decided downsides to this route, but it is a hell of a lot easier. [Big Grin]

--------------------
There are three things you can be sure of in life: Death, taxes, and reading about fake illnesses online...

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Leo00o0
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Icon 1 posted December 25, 2006 14:33      Profile for Leo00o0     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
metasquares, the laws, in the west coast of US atleast, are extremely favored toward women, so finding someone who would also "be screwed up in the process" will be practically impossible.

and thanks for addressing the issue, metasquares.

dragon, I'm not gonna stray from the subject too much here, despite the fact that your reply seemed semi-interested in my dilemma, so if you really wanna know what's behind the lifestyle of not having a relationship untill you reach your career goal, you can start listening to Leykis at blowmeuptomDOTcom. it's something that's not easily explained in a few paragraphs here, especially coming from a virgin(!)

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supergoo

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Icon 1 posted December 25, 2006 14:36      Profile for supergoo     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Metasquares:
Relationships are a huge drain on both time and money, so I agree that they do need to be balanced with other goals. I agree with Xanthine on this; if you're worried about someone attempting to screw up your life, find someone whose life will also be screwed up in the process.

I can agree with the drain on time, but money? I'm cheap!

Well, not like that kind of cheap... I guess "low maintenance" would be a better phrase.

--------------------
Y los sueños, sueños son.

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CommanderShroom
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Icon 1 posted December 25, 2006 15:08      Profile for CommanderShroom     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Womens are t3h 3v1l!!

I am especially frightened because of their inherent black magicks. Did you know they sacrifice virgin men for their power?

Another Tom Leykis fan... I have heard him before. But usually when I wish to destroy brain cells, gin and soft jazz do it with much less agony.

--------------------
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Xanthine

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Icon 1 posted December 25, 2006 16:08      Profile for Xanthine     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by business attire:
your imagination is so... vivid!
but, then again, I can actually see all those events happening.

Right. So our liason will happen on top of a 50 story building. [Wink]

quote:
Originally posted by Leo00o0:
metasquares, the laws, in the west coast of US atleast, are extremely favored toward women, so finding someone who would also "be screwed up in the process" will be practically impossible.

Oh yeah, because having a baby right now would make my life SO much better and easier. I mean, come on, working long hours in the lab is completely and totally facilitated by having a kid at home who needs food and love and supervision. Not to mention the sheer fantasticness of being pregnant. That would make working with x-rays and radioactive DNA so much more fun and carefree, and also make those long hours in the lab, and the bike I ride to get there, so much easier. And then focusing on publications and my own bright future as a scientist will be so easy because, you know, my priorities won't have to shift at all. And I'm sure my medical insurance will suddenly get fantastic just because I'm pregnant. Oh, and things like travelling and SCUBA diving and climbing big mountains is also much easier to accomplish with the simple addition of a child to my life.

Oh yeah, I have nothing to lose and everything to gain by getting pregnant in grad school. It was my life's ambition to sit on my ass and be supported by some a man anyways. That's why I went in for a PhD in the first place. Because everyone loves an over-educated woman. Fsck this independence crap. I'm going to get pregnant right now and make my life better. All that matters is money. My dreams and goals, that doesn't matter. I'll have a kid and get rich that way. Everything else I want will be put on hold or lost forever, but that doesn't matter. And it'll be, like, totally fair to the kid that I had him or her just to cash out. Now where's that kreziserb... [Roll Eyes]

--------------------
And it's one, two, three / On the wrong side of the lee / What were you meant for? / What were you meant for?
- The Decemberists

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nerdwithnofriends
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Icon 1 posted December 25, 2006 16:56      Profile for nerdwithnofriends     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Xanthine:
quote:
Originally posted by business attire:
your imagination is so... vivid!
but, then again, I can actually see all those events happening.

Right. So our liason will happen on top of a 50 story building. [Wink]

quote:
Originally posted by Leo00o0:
metasquares, the laws, in the west coast of US atleast, are extremely favored toward women, so finding someone who would also "be screwed up in the process" will be practically impossible.

Oh yeah, because having a baby right now would make my life SO much better and easier. I mean, come on, working long hours in the lab is completely and totally facilitated by having a kid at home who needs food and love and supervision. Not to mention the sheer fantasticness of being pregnant. That would make working with x-rays and radioactive DNA so much more fun and carefree, and also make those long hours in the lab, and the bike I ride to get there, so much easier. And then focusing on publications and my own bright future as a scientist will be so easy because, you know, my priorities won't have to shift at all. And I'm sure my medical insurance will suddenly get fantastic just because I'm pregnant. Oh, and things like travelling and SCUBA diving and climbing big mountains is also much easier to accomplish with the simple addition of a child to my life.

Oh yeah, I have nothing to lose and everything to gain by getting pregnant in grad school. It was my life's ambition to sit on my ass and be supported by some a man anyways. That's why I went in for a PhD in the first place. Because everyone loves an over-educated woman. Fsck this independence crap. I'm going to get pregnant right now and make my life better. All that matters is money. My dreams and goals, that doesn't matter. I'll have a kid and get rich that way. Everything else I want will be put on hold or lost forever, but that doesn't matter. And it'll be, like, totally fair to the kid that I had him or her just to cash out. Now where's that kreziserb... [Roll Eyes]

I guess there's a reason he's not trying to sw00n you [Razz]

What radioisotopes do you use in your lab DNA? Just out of curiosity.

--------------------
"The Buddha, the Godhead, resides quite as comfortably in the circuits of a digital computer or the gears of a cycle transmission as he does at the top of a mountain or in the petals of a flower." - Robert M. Pirsig

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GrumpySteen

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Icon 1 posted December 25, 2006 17:33      Profile for GrumpySteen     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Xanthine wrote:
Fsck this independence crap. I'm going to get pregnant right now and make my life better. All that matters is money. My dreams and goals, that doesn't matter. I'll have a kid and get rich that way. Everything else I want will be put on hold or lost forever, but that doesn't matter. And it'll be, like, totally fair to the kid that I had him or her just to cash out. Now where's that kreziserb... [Roll Eyes]

Well... at least Santa would be happy. You might even get something besides coal in your stocking next year [Wink]

--------------------
Worst. Celibate. Ever.

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Xanthine

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Icon 1 posted December 25, 2006 19:56      Profile for Xanthine     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Oh yeah, that's another thing havinga baby would do...make living on an ice cliff impossible. [Razz]

nwnf: we use phosphorous-32, and we buy it already bundled up in ATP molecules so labeling the DNA is a simple task of transfering phosphates around. It's a high energy beta-emitter with a half-life of two weeks, so waste disposal is pretty easy - you just leave it in a shielded container for a couple months and then throw it out with te regular trash. Once the DNA is labeled, it's all good, but the labeling reaction tends to make an unholy mess, especially when the label is fresh.

--------------------
And it's one, two, three / On the wrong side of the lee / What were you meant for? / What were you meant for?
- The Decemberists

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MacManKrisK

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Icon 1 posted December 25, 2006 23:17      Profile for MacManKrisK     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Okay, relationships and sex are completely illogical! I know, I'm in one, and I've struggled with the theorizing, the illogicalness, and the downright sillyness of it all. I spent a great deal of the beginning of my relationship trying to figure out /why/ I wanted to be in it, /what/ made Steph feel like the right one... on and on and on, and I drove myself (and her) nuts until I gave up and just accepted the fact that there are some things in life that are simply illogical! After listening to my aunts and uncles (and my parents) argue, and listening to these crappy love advice shows, I was convinced that I NEVER wanted to deal with that stuff. There was a point in time when I, literally, wanted to just castrate myself and be done with it all.

If you want to be purely logical, and never take any undue risks, then never get in a relationship and never have sex, period. The sad part, though, is that those who never take risks never gain anything, their lives tend to be boring and flat and, well, lifeless.

IMHO, sex isn't really /all/ that great, I find the expierence of the relationship, the emotional intamacy, much more fulfilling; YMMV. Relationships take a lot of time, usually a lot of money, and a lot of energy. It's not a spectator sport or something you can do in your spare time.

Lastly: if you're not going to treat the woman you're with with respect, and decency, and view her as an /actual/ person with /actual/ feelings, then just don't get involved.

--------------------
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get rich and you still die"


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Leo00o0
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Icon 1 posted December 26, 2006 00:36      Profile for Leo00o0     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
macman, thanks for the straight reply.

the way I see it there's a HUGE difference between necessary risk (like building a career) and unnecessary risk. Women, for me, an unnecessary risk.

Going for the "just accept it how it is" lifestyle when I don't have to doesn't make sense to me. and that's my dilemma.

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nerdwithnofriends
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Icon 1 posted December 26, 2006 01:28      Profile for nerdwithnofriends     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Xanthine:
Oh yeah, that's another thing havinga baby would do...make living on an ice cliff impossible. [Razz]

nwnf: we use phosphorous-32, and we buy it already bundled up in ATP molecules so labeling the DNA is a simple task of transfering phosphates around. It's a high energy beta-emitter with a half-life of two weeks, so waste disposal is pretty easy - you just leave it in a shielded container for a couple months and then throw it out with te regular trash. Once the DNA is labeled, it's all good, but the labeling reaction tends to make an unholy mess, especially when the label is fresh.

Oh, that makes sense. I thought maybe you guys were using an isotope of carbon or nitrogen. I can't say about carbon, but IIRC nitrogen doesn't have an isotope with a halflife longer than like 10 minutes. If you guys were were using that, I'd be the green with envy because it would mean you had a cyclotron in your lab.

--------------------
"The Buddha, the Godhead, resides quite as comfortably in the circuits of a digital computer or the gears of a cycle transmission as he does at the top of a mountain or in the petals of a flower." - Robert M. Pirsig

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garlicguy

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Icon 1 posted December 26, 2006 07:26      Profile for garlicguy   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Xanthine:
I'll have a kid and get rich that way.

Why stop with one? Have a dozen or so, all by different men, and become Uber-rich! Fun *and* easy.
[Big Grin]

--------------------
I don't know what I was thinking... it seemed like a good idea at the time.

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freja42
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Icon 1 posted December 26, 2006 16:01      Profile for freja42     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Dear GeekVirgin, I really think you should stop looking at that Leykins show. It sounds like absolute rubbish to me.

Spend time with women, date more than you want to - that way you can analyse and think about what you want and what they want from you.

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freja42
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Icon 1 posted December 26, 2006 16:03      Profile for freja42     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Metasquares:
Relationships are a huge drain on both time and money, so I agree that they do need to be balanced with other goals. I agree with Xanthine on this; if you're worried about someone attempting to screw up your life, find someone whose life will also be screwed up in the process.

I think you've been in bad relationships.
A good relationship whether it's friendship or sexual should GIVE you energy. If it doesn't, it's not good for you.

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AgingAmigaoid
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Icon 1 posted December 26, 2006 17:14      Profile for AgingAmigaoid     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Leo00o0:
I've listening to Leykis [...]
My attitude towards women right now - cannot trust them.

Leykis has been married and divorced four times,

And you're taking advice from him???

As a 40-mumble year-old geek who has been happily married for 20-mumble years I can't begin to tell you how sad reading all this makes me.

Take Supergoo's advice and Be Nice!

Add to that my advice:

If you don't find a woman to be someone you want to be with forever, then keep your pants on! I'm not saying you have to spend forever with your first choice but if you can't see yourself with her forever then choose another before you do something that may "force" you together forever.

I can't imagine making it through 3 dates let alone being physically intimate with someone that I think might take a used condom and invert it to trap me.

Let emotional intimacy come first and then trust will follow... If you don't reach trust then you shouldn't be physically intimate anyways.

And stop listening to that Leykis guy. Really! He is seriously destroying you!

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Leo00o0
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Icon 14 posted December 26, 2006 17:27      Profile for Leo00o0     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
thanks for the advice, amigaoid
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freja42
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Icon 1 posted December 27, 2006 01:23      Profile for freja42     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by AgingAmigaoid:

And you're taking advice from him???

As a 40-mumble year-old geek who has been happily married for 20-mumble years I can't begin to tell you how sad reading all this makes me.

If you don't find a woman to be someone you want to be with forever, then keep your pants on! I'm not saying you have to spend forever with your first choice but if you can't see yourself with her forever then choose another before you do something that may "force" you together forever.

I can't imagine making it through 3 dates let alone being physically intimate with someone that I think might take a used condom and invert it to trap me.

While I agree with that you shouldn't have sex with anyone you don't feel comfortable with, I don't see how "being with someone for eternity" is the right way to go?

To me, it takes time to get to know someone and to understand if they are "the one".
There is no way to know on the first date if she/he is the one. Those romantic ideals that we get fed with are myths.

Real love grows over the years and there is no guarantee it will last, ever.
But does that mean that we shouldn't have relationships?

Personally, I think we should enjoy life and try to make the best out of it.
There is a balance in all things, as is it with love and sex.
It is also true that practise makes perfect.

How can you know if you're really in love or if you love someone unless you have something to compare it to?
I think that's why so many teenagers think that their first crush is "the one true love", because they are overwhelmed by their emotions and they have nothing to compare it to.

I think that you shouldn't be with someone you don't feel good with/about but on the other hand, you shouldn't stay away from women just because you don't want to marry them.

Really, there is such a thing as a happy relationship even if it just lasts for a couple of years.

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AgingAmigaoid
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Icon 1 posted December 27, 2006 10:26      Profile for AgingAmigaoid     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by freja42:
I don't see how "being with someone for eternity" is the right way to go? [...] Really, there is such a thing as a happy relationship even if it just lasts for a couple of years.

Allow me to quote myself:

quote:
Originally posted by AgingAmigaoid:
I'm not saying you have to spend forever with your first choice but if you can't see yourself with her forever then choose another before you do something that may "force" you together forever.

As LeoOOoO primary concerns seem to revolve around a "pregnancy trap" I think it's fair to acknowledge that pregnancy is a possible result of any hetero-sexual "union." LeoOOoO has already stated concern that a handjob could, in some .0000001% chance, result in a pregnancy. A true, albeit highly improbable concern.

So, once a pregnancy results in a living child then, I believe, man and woman are connected for the life of that child. If for nothing more than making holiday visitation arrangements.

So, back that all the way to: Don't lay with someone you can't imagine being connected to for the rest of your life.

If you follow that simple rule, along with "Be Nice", you most likely won't find yourself with a psycho-woman who will invert your used condom to trick you or smash your skull with a telephone in your post-coital slumber to steal your kidney.

I think LeoOOoO's biggest problem is that he has taken a very "geek" approach here in the belief that pregnancy could happen so he needs to mitigate that risk. Yea! Good thinking! Unfortunately he has allowed this Leykis jerk to convince him that women will trap him into pregnancy. Boo! Very flawed thinking.

So let's change the thinking to; a woman could trap you, or smash your skull and steal your kidney. How do you mitigate that risk? I think I've answered that.

But LeoOOoO, you've got to change your goal from
quote:
[how do I] experiment sexually untill I can afford to be with an attractive girl?
to "how do I have emotionally satisfying relationships that will allow me to experiment sexually?"

I have been with women that I could have spent forever with and I have been with women that were easy targets and the post-coital emptiness with the easy targets was very real as was the 28-day, oh s--t, what have I done, waiting period. If you work towards avoiding those moments then you'll never find yourself in a bathtub full of ice missing a kidney.

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freja42
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Icon 1 posted December 27, 2006 10:54      Profile for freja42     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by AgingAmigaoid:
As LeoOOoO primary concerns seem to revolve around a "pregnancy trap" I think it's fair to acknowledge that pregnancy is a possible result of any hetero-sexual "union." LeoOOoO has already stated concern that a handjob could, in some .0000001% chance, result in a pregnancy. A true, albeit highly improbable concern.

So, once a pregnancy results in a living child then, I believe, man and woman are connected for the life of that child. If for nothing more than making holiday visitation arrangements.

So, back that all the way to: Don't lay with someone you can't imagine being connected to for the rest of your life.

If you follow that simple rule, along with "Be Nice", you most likely won't find yourself with a psycho-woman who will invert your used condom to trick you or smash your skull with a telephone in your post-coital slumber to steal your kidney.

I think LeoOOoO's biggest problem is that he has taken a very "geek" approach here in the belief that pregnancy could happen so he needs to mitigate that risk. Yea! Good thinking! Unfortunately he has allowed this Leykis jerk to convince him that women will trap him into pregnancy. Boo! Very flawed thinking.

So let's change the thinking to; a woman could trap you, or smash your skull and steal your kidney. How do you mitigate that risk? I think I've answered that.

But LeoOOoO, you've got to change your goal from
quote:
[how do I] experiment sexually untill I can afford to be with an attractive girl?
to "how do I have emotionally satisfying relationships that will allow me to experiment sexually?"

I have been with women that I could have spent forever with and I have been with women that were easy targets and the post-coital emptiness with the easy targets was very real as was the 28-day, oh s--t, what have I done, waiting period. If you work towards avoiding those moments then you'll never find yourself in a bathtub full of ice missing a kidney.

Again, why does it have to be so black and white?

If you have sex with a condom and spermicidal cream, the chances/risks of getting pregnant are very low.
Also, one can actually have sex without having intercourse so...
As for getting pregnant by a handjob - I doubt it has ever happened and if it hasn't happened, it doesn't matter what the calculated risks are.

I do understand yours and his concerns when it comes to pregnancy. I don't share it myself but that's another issue and I won't get into a debate about abortion either.

I do agree that it's probably better for him, as I judge it, to get to know a woman before he has sex with her, in a stable relationship, since it seems like he doesn't trust women at all - if all women are out to get pregnant or steal his kidney.

My best advice is actually to go to a therapist and see what he says (I say he because I think it's best if this guy chooses a male therapist).

What I argue against in your advice is mostly the black and white way of seeing the situation.
Does it have to be either one night stands or the love of your life?
I have been with men that I thought I loved and men that I was in love with, I have never once had a one night stand and neither have I been married.
I believe there is such a thing as a balanced healthy sexual life.

ANyway, I doubt he'll listen to my advice, what with me being female and probably out to get him... [Roll Eyes]

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CommanderShroom
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Icon 1 posted December 27, 2006 11:54      Profile for CommanderShroom     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I think he has absolutely nothing to worry about. With the level of paranoia that I have seen so far, he better like himself. I do believe he will spend the rest of his days getting to *ahem* know himself very well.

So responding on the values of interpersonal relationships is a moot point.

--------------------
Does he know our big secret?
Has one of us confessed?
'Bout the wires circuits and motors
Buried in our chest

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AgingAmigaoid
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Icon 1 posted December 27, 2006 12:15      Profile for AgingAmigaoid     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by freja42:
What I argue against in your advice is mostly the black and white way of seeing the situation.
Does it have to be either one night stands or the love of your life?

Let's touch on the abortion issue just a tad: It's not an option for any man. A man can't impose it or refuse it. So if the handjob leads to a pregnancy then it is out of his hands (every GC thread requires a pun by the end of page 2.) So it is a bit more black and white for the man. It either happened or it didn't. The man has no choice once it has happened.

But that's not the black and white we're talking about.

I'm not sure I ever refered to one-night-stands but I do know I've never had one either. I have stayed too long in a relationship that I knew was going nowhere and allowed it to turn sexual and then had to face the thought of, "what if we just made this permanent?"

My advice was to work towards avoiding those moments of regret (and thereby avoid being "trapped" by gold-digging psychos who want your babies and your kidney.)

"Work towards avoiding" is a very grey statement. "Work towards avoiding death while crossing the street" does not mean "never cross the street"

And can someone tell me why the lyrics to Meatloaf's Paradise by the Dashboard Lights keep going around and around in my head?

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Mel
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Icon 1 posted December 28, 2006 11:49      Profile for Mel     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
The problem is the way you went about doing this - researching other people's experiences with relationships. The only way you'll know what they're about is to actually experience them. Obviously looking at the experiences of others will alter what you think. It's like hearing gossip about someone and trying not to forget it when you meet the person. Also, relationships and sex are different for everyone, so who do you believe? Ignore what you read and have your own experiences.
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Icon 5 posted December 28, 2006 13:40      Profile for Leo00o0     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
thanks for the great replies so far.

Mel, yeah you're right I don't know who to believe anymore. Some people found the right mate (either for a few years or for many years), and others didn't, so their opinions about this varies a lot.

Still it doesn't feel right to me either way, the whole thing.

but anyway,thanks for the advice everybody [thumbsup]

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Aramaki
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Icon 1 posted December 28, 2006 20:52      Profile for Aramaki     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
My advice was to work towards avoiding those moments of regret (and thereby avoid being "trapped" by gold-digging psychos who want your babies and your kidney.)
You'd think that there'd be an easier way to obtain a kidney...
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dragonman97

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Icon 1 posted December 28, 2006 22:18      Profile for dragonman97   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
"Still it doesn't feel right to me either way, the whole thing."

If you're not willing to play with fire, stay out of the frying pan.

Speaking of playing with fire, I saw a damn cool act today in Washington Square. Dude not only juggled fire, swallowed it, breathed it (and make a 10+ foot fireball), but held it in his hands. The fool in me does worry a little about the sustainability of this...but I suppose entering a ticket for the Darwin Awards is his choice. (And oops, I enabled that with a donation...but I'm pretty sure he needs that in the short term.) This ladies and germs, is why I'm the Ice Dragon. ;P

Presuming that you're more likely just a troll...please just leave this thread to die. In fact, I'm pretty good at making threads die by the pure boredom factor of my posts. Here goes nothing... [Smile]

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There are three things you can be sure of in life: Death, taxes, and reading about fake illnesses online...

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