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Author Topic: 9/11 and 4/11
dragonman97

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Icon 1 posted July 21, 2008 15:05      Profile for dragonman97   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Danger - competent thinking present:
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/20/opinion/20friedman.html

Can't wait to see how skewed this could be perceived by one missing a few screws. [Wink]

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There are three things you can be sure of in life: Death, taxes, and reading about fake illnesses online...

Posts: 9332 | From: Westchester County, New York | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Colonel Panic
BlabberMouth, the Next Generation
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Icon 1 posted July 21, 2008 18:45      Profile for Colonel Panic         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I don't think screws were ever used.

Pop rivets, yes.

CP

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Posts: 1809 | From: Glacier Melt, USA | Registered: Mar 2002  |  IP: Logged
The Famous Druid

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Icon 1 posted July 22, 2008 15:08      Profile for The Famous Druid     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
The analogy with addiction is a good one.

The arguments used by the climate change deniers are eerily reminiscent of the propaganda the tobacco companies used to put about, until their lawyers told them that denying the bleeding obvious made them liable to huge damages claims from their victims.

Yes, laboratory results show rats get cancer from our product, but that's just lab rats, there's no proof it has the same effect on humans.

Yes, statistics show that smokers are far more likely to get cancer, but that's just statistics, correlation doesn't prove causation. There might be some (unspecified) 'other factor' at work that's causing the cancer.

Yes, the overwhelming weight of scientific opinion is against us, but we've found this nutter at Jed Clampett University And Truck Repair Service who disagrees, and we're going to spend millions publicising his opinion to muddy the waters. Please don't ask who funded his 'research'.


Anyone with half a brain could see through such obvious tactics, but the addicts, desperate to believe their addiction was safe, lapped it up.

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If you watch 'The History Of NASA' backwards, it's about a space agency that has no manned spaceflight capability, then does low-orbit flights, then lands on the Moon.

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TheMoMan
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Icon 1 posted July 22, 2008 18:13      Profile for TheMoMan         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
___________________ TFD you are at a slight disadvantage, just this evening J. McCains ad about needing to drill came on just before T. Boone Pickins ad about this is one problem we can not drill our way out of. One begins to wonder if the advertisers knew the schedule. See Tilting at Windmills.

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Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.


Benjamin Franklin,

Posts: 5848 | From: Just South of the Huron National Forest, in the water shed of the Rifle River | Registered: Sep 2002  |  IP: Logged
dragonman97

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Icon 1 posted July 24, 2008 15:10      Profile for dragonman97   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Regarding McCain, may I get a friggin' w00t?!

Is ‘The One’ Cocky or Commander in Chiefy?
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/23/opinion/23dowd.html

Obama pwns McCain in Iraq. [Big Grin]

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There are three things you can be sure of in life: Death, taxes, and reading about fake illnesses online...

Posts: 9332 | From: Westchester County, New York | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Colonel Panic
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Icon 1 posted July 24, 2008 15:43      Profile for Colonel Panic         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by dragonman97:
Regarding McCain, may I get a friggin' w00t?!

Is ‘The One’ Cocky or Commander in Chiefy?
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/23/opinion/23dowd.html

Obama pwns McCain in Iraq. [Big Grin]

Poor McCain, his "Straight-Talk Express" has become a short, yellow bus called the "Double-Talk Express" as he spins and spins the reasons why he and the rest of Repujblican party shoud let the mastermind of 9-11 off the hook.

Go Obama! Get Osama!

CP

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TheMoMan
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Icon 1 posted July 25, 2008 03:57      Profile for TheMoMan         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
____________________ Does any one have an opinion on Gen. Wesley Clark as Veep?

I feel we could do far worse.

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Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.


Benjamin Franklin,

Posts: 5848 | From: Just South of the Huron National Forest, in the water shed of the Rifle River | Registered: Sep 2002  |  IP: Logged
The Famous Druid

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Icon 1 posted July 25, 2008 06:40      Profile for The Famous Druid     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by TheMoMan:
____________________ Does any one have an opinion on Gen. Wesley Clark as Veep?

I feel we could do far worse.

There are many countries where a career in the military is pretty-much a prerequisite for government.

Can't honestly say I'm impressed with how well they're governed.

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If you watch 'The History Of NASA' backwards, it's about a space agency that has no manned spaceflight capability, then does low-orbit flights, then lands on the Moon.

Posts: 10680 | From: Melbourne, Australia | Registered: Oct 2002  |  IP: Logged
TheMoMan
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Icon 1 posted July 25, 2008 08:01      Profile for TheMoMan         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
____________________ TFD I am not totally sure on this but I have reason to believe that Gen. Clark stepped on some toes, during the rescue of Scott O'Grady, seems that NATO wanted to run a joint exercise in the morning and some General and an Admiral said "he's our boy we know where he is, the enemy is closing in, we are going to go get him." Shorty afterward Gen. Clark was sent to run a desk at the Pentagon, usual treatment for Generals that step on allies toes.

I may be wrong on who did the signing of the orders but I doubt it.

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Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.


Benjamin Franklin,

Posts: 5848 | From: Just South of the Huron National Forest, in the water shed of the Rifle River | Registered: Sep 2002  |  IP: Logged
The Famous Druid

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Icon 1 posted July 25, 2008 15:15      Profile for The Famous Druid     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I wasn't commenting on General Clark himself, I have no opinion of the guy either way, but on the tendency in the USA to look for generals to fill civilian political roles.

Most democracies work pretty hard to keep the military out of politics, those that don't often cease to be democracies.

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If you watch 'The History Of NASA' backwards, it's about a space agency that has no manned spaceflight capability, then does low-orbit flights, then lands on the Moon.

Posts: 10680 | From: Melbourne, Australia | Registered: Oct 2002  |  IP: Logged
Colonel Panic
BlabberMouth, the Next Generation
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Icon 1 posted July 25, 2008 15:32      Profile for Colonel Panic         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by The Famous Druid:
Most democracies work pretty hard to keep the military out of politics, those that don't often cease to be democracies.

The first President of the first democratic republic of the industrial age was a former general. Washington, I think his name was.

He didn't do a bad job at all, in fact he did a lot better than the former Texas Air National Guard flyboy we have barnstorming through the world right now.

Mo-Man, I think General Clark is a good guy, but maybe a bit of a flake.

CP

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The Famous Druid

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Icon 1 posted July 25, 2008 15:57      Profile for The Famous Druid     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Colonel Panic:
The first President of the first democratic republic of the industrial age was a former general. Washington, I think his name was.

And look at all the trouble that guy caused. [Wink]

The things you find in Wikipedia

Of the 42 presidents on the list (there's one missing, CBA finding out who)...

12 have been generals.
11 have held other senior ranks (majors or above)
7 have been junior officers
1 was a private
11 were never in the military.

So, over half of the US presidents have been senior military officers before entering politics.

I doubt if you'd find another democracy with such a high percentage.

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If you watch 'The History Of NASA' backwards, it's about a space agency that has no manned spaceflight capability, then does low-orbit flights, then lands on the Moon.

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tweety
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Icon 1 posted July 25, 2008 20:00      Profile for tweety   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I used to work for a defense contractor. Most of my colleagues were ex-Navy (the company I worked for specialized in Navy work). A great many of them where fairly open, if not downright Libertarian. In fact, one guy I worked with was very much an outspoken Libertarian. (As an aside, one of my first bosses at that shop was ex-Intelligence. You never, ever knew what he was thinking. Need to know was at the core of that one.)

Maybe it's something in the water over here, but my experience might go a long way in explaining why we haven't devolved into a military dictatorship. Well, except for now, but not too many people realize it yet. [Big Grin]

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The Famous Druid

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Icon 1 posted July 26, 2008 02:10      Profile for The Famous Druid     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by tweety:
I used to work for a defense contractor...
... one guy I worked with was very much an outspoken Libertarian.

It's one of life's little ironies, every Libertarian I've met here in oz (they're not as common here as they are in the land of merkins) has been in a job where The Taxpayer was the ultimate source of their pay cheque.

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If you watch 'The History Of NASA' backwards, it's about a space agency that has no manned spaceflight capability, then does low-orbit flights, then lands on the Moon.

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shentzu
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Icon 1 posted July 26, 2008 20:17      Profile for shentzu     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by The Famous Druid:
quote:
Originally posted by tweety:
I used to work for a defense contractor...
... one guy I worked with was very much an outspoken Libertarian.

It's one of life's little ironies, every Libertarian I've met here in oz (they're not as common here as they are in the land of merkins) has been in a job where The Taxpayer was the ultimate source of their pay cheque.
i hadn't made the connection until i read this earlier today, and now i am trying to find a libertarian i have met who doesn't do the same.....

....been trying for hours. that is deeply disturbing.

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Set a man by a fire and you keep him warm for a day, but set a man on fire and you keep him warm for the rest of his life.

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tweety
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Icon 1 posted July 27, 2008 14:49      Profile for tweety   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Don't worry about it, shenzu. What I realized, after some reflection on this subject, is that Libertarians are just Republicans in disguise.

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If I were a good man I'd talk to you more often than I do.
American Fairy Tales
IT, A Philosophy

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