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» The Geek Culture Forums   » News, Reviews, Views!   » Politics/Religion/Current Affairs   » From YouTube... American soldiers shooting civilians (?) (Page 1)

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Author Topic: From YouTube... American soldiers shooting civilians (?)
Snaggy

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Icon 4 posted March 26, 2007 07:48      Profile for Snaggy   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Jace, is this a typical day in Iraq?

http://tinyurl.com/yveesc

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Cap'n Vic

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Icon 1 posted March 26, 2007 08:48      Profile for Cap'n Vic     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Pretty typical I bet. It makes you wonder. If those fuckers are stupid enough to video tape something like that, what would do when the camera isn't rolling.

There have been all kinds of shit like this surface on the net. I remember seeing one where (US contractors?) were driving around on the freeways shooting at oncoming civilian vehicles and laughing like hell.

Here are some real fucking heros.

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BooBooKitty

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Icon 2 posted March 26, 2007 10:31      Profile for BooBooKitty     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
*sigh*

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m9A_vxIOB-I

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Just_Jess_B

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Icon 2 posted March 26, 2007 10:35      Profile for Just_Jess_B   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Stupidity + (Video) Cameras = Ability to See Worst in Humanity.

*sigh* indeed.

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ASM65816
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Icon 1 posted March 26, 2007 16:41      Profile for ASM65816   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
from an article Mar 26, 2007:

Terrorists in Iraq have passed an unthinkable threshold: They used two children to disguise a car bomb.... When the terrorists got to their target, they got out of the car and ran. They left the children behind in the car, and then blew it up.

(pictures of charred human flesh and twisted metal withheld)

Do Muslims worship god?

Why does god tell them to blow-up their children?

Why do Muslims kill so many Muslims?

I guess I'm a heretic ... that probably explains why I don't hear god telling me to kill Muslims or anybody else.

The news indicated that the people who murdered the children so they could kill many more people were dressed in ordinary civilian clothes. Terrorists are not wandering about in "I'm a terrorist" uniforms; they're typically in civilian clothes ... unless they specifically want to get shot and die alone (and god would hate them for not killing anyone else before dying).

Just for fun, why don't we put up some pictures of the Muslims that were mutilated and beheaded by other Muslims, or some car bomb pics where you can see a few body parts lying around.....

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Callipygous
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Icon 1 posted March 26, 2007 16:53      Profile for Callipygous     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
A similar horrible tale.

I have no words. ASM you should be ashamed of yourself trying to justify this. We managed to fight WW2 without setting up our own death camps.

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"Knowledge is Power. France is Bacon" - Milton

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The Famous Druid

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Icon 1 posted March 26, 2007 19:08      Profile for The Famous Druid     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I blame the French, and the Russians, and the Chinese, the UN, Iran, Saddam, North Korea, and Darfur.

In fact, I blame everyone in the world except those brave American boys who pulled the trigger on some poor sod who just happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time.

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Ashitaka

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Icon 1 posted March 26, 2007 21:57      Profile for Ashitaka     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Tony Benn (who is a little too left for my taste) schools Ex US ambasador Bolton. Great to watch. Will cheer one up after watching those other horrible videos.

Tony Benn schools Bolton

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"If they're not gonna make a distinction between Muslims and violent extremists, then why should I take the time to distinguish between decent, fearful white people and racists?"

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ASM65816
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Icon 1 posted March 26, 2007 22:04      Profile for ASM65816   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
March 26, 2007 16:53
ASM you should be ashamed of yourself trying to justify this.

I'm not "justifying" it. I'm reminding a few people that if you really want to see blood and guts and senseless slaughter, check out some non-Americans over there.

I only watched a little of the video, but I noticed the troops had something like a LAW rocket. If they really wanted to create some carnage, wouldn't something that rips main battle tanks apart be better than a "two cent slug" that barely chips away at concrete?

quote:
March 26, 2007 19:08
I blame ..........................

You forgot to blame god. If you're an atheist, then that would be understandable, but otherwise, god seems to have provided the primary justification for Muslims being killed by suicide car bombs, and death squads from rival religious sects.

Just curious.... If a Muslim puts his children in a car filled with 500 pounds of plastic explosives and blows them apart so another two dozen Muslims are killed in the blast, does he go to heaven?

Why wouldn't someone else go to heaven for killing Muslims?

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Once a proud programmer of Apple II's, he now spends his days and nights in cheap dives fraternizing with exotic dancers....

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Callipygous
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Icon 1 posted March 27, 2007 07:13      Profile for Callipygous     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
ASM [shake head]

I thought it was conservatives that despised moral relativism. One can also see many more hideous things if one looks at the films made when Dachau and Auschwitz were liberated. That makes anything the US does now OK. Right?

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Sxeptomaniac

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Icon 1 posted March 27, 2007 08:05      Profile for Sxeptomaniac   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Question: How do we know that the people shot in that original video were innocent civilians? I get the feeling the video is picked up towards the middle or end of something else, and that there was more going on to the right. Without getting into the whole war issue, can we consider that maybe the video doesn't tell us the whole story?

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TheMoMan
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Icon 1 posted March 27, 2007 09:29      Profile for TheMoMan         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Snaggy ------------------- I did not not watch the video, I can replay the real thing.

Timing is every thing, this may be out of context or just plain ruthless killing. I am not about to second guess what happoned or why, it happened, now there are more bodies to bury.

It seems that the Arabs have learned from the Vietnamiesse how to make something innocent very deadly, I lost a good friend to a booby traped kid, it hurts worse than if they had just shot him. That I could deal with but why kill the kid to get one US Soldier?

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Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.


Benjamin Franklin,

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The Explainer
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Icon 1 posted March 27, 2007 11:21      Profile for The Explainer     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by ASM65816:
if you really want to see blood and guts and senseless slaughter, check out some non-Americans over there.

Mr 65816 believes that any sin can be excused by reference to a worse sinner.

quote:
I noticed the troops had something like a LAW rocket. If they really wanted to create some carnage, wouldn't something that rips main battle tanks apart be better than a "two cent slug" that barely chips away at concrete?

Mr 65816 believes that any sin can be excused by claiming there's a worse sin you could have committed if you'd wanted to.
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The Famous Druid

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Icon 1 posted March 27, 2007 15:01      Profile for The Famous Druid     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
In other news, it's ok to torture people, as long as they're not Americans

quote:
From TFA:
A US court has dismissed a lawsuit against former US defence secretary Donald Rumsfeld over claims prisoners were tortured in Iraq and Afghanistan.

The court accepted that the nine men who sued had been tortured - and detailed the torture in its ruling.

But Judge Thomas Hogan ruled the five Iraqis and four Afghans did not have US constitutional rights, and also that Mr Rumsfeld was immune from such suits.



--------------------
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WinterSolstice

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Icon 1 posted March 27, 2007 16:31      Profile for WinterSolstice     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by The Famous Druid:
In other news, it's ok to torture people, as long as they're not Americans

quote:
From TFA:
A US court has dismissed a lawsuit against former US defence secretary Donald Rumsfeld over claims prisoners were tortured in Iraq and Afghanistan.

The court accepted that the nine men who sued had been tortured - and detailed the torture in its ruling.

But Judge Thomas Hogan ruled the five Iraqis and four Afghans did not have US constitutional rights, and also that Mr Rumsfeld was immune from such suits.


Perhaps because that suit should come in a different court? I hope we see a war crimes tribunal at some point against some individuals.

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An operating system should be like a light switch... simple, effective, easy to use, and designed for everyone.

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Cap'n Vic

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Icon 1 posted March 27, 2007 18:48      Profile for Cap'n Vic     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by WinterSolstice:
quote:
Originally posted by The Famous Druid:
In other news, it's ok to torture people, as long as they're not Americans

quote:
From TFA:
A US court has dismissed a lawsuit against former US defence secretary Donald Rumsfeld over claims prisoners were tortured in Iraq and Afghanistan.

The court accepted that the nine men who sued had been tortured - and detailed the torture in its ruling.

But Judge Thomas Hogan ruled the five Iraqis and four Afghans did not have US constitutional rights, and also that Mr Rumsfeld was immune from such suits.


Perhaps because that suit should come in a different court? I hope we see a war crimes tribunal at some point against some individuals.
Like this clown?


 -

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(!) (T) = 8-D

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Xanthine

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Icon 1 posted March 27, 2007 19:00      Profile for Xanthine     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
We have to impeach the bastard first. Either that or wait until he leaves office.

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And it's one, two, three / On the wrong side of the lee / What were you meant for? / What were you meant for?
- The Decemberists

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ScholasticSpastic
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Icon 1 posted March 27, 2007 22:38      Profile for ScholasticSpastic     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
He's almost finished either way!!!!!
(yay!)

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Callipygous
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Icon 1 posted March 28, 2007 02:03      Profile for Callipygous     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I just saw this on the UK MacUser web site. Check out the word "democracy" in the thesaurus of built in dictionary/thesaurus in MacOS X, either using the app itself or the widget. You'll get an interesting example sentence.

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WinterSolstice

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Icon 1 posted March 28, 2007 06:13      Profile for WinterSolstice     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Nice... try "president" [Big Grin]

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An operating system should be like a light switch... simple, effective, easy to use, and designed for everyone.

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Callipygous
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Icon 1 posted March 28, 2007 07:25      Profile for Callipygous     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
The Economist magazine initially supported the US invasion of Iraq. It is therefore interesting to read this perceptive analysis of how it all went wrong. The YouTube videos that are the subject of this thread are, of course, part of the collapse of US moral authority and prestige that this article delineates, and that ASM, is why they are both important, and so so depressing. Be grateful that the infrastructure of the country is still so messed up that few Iraqis will get to see them.

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The Famous Druid

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Icon 1 posted March 28, 2007 12:39      Profile for The Famous Druid     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Interesting article Calli, especially the part where only 43% of Iraqis want a democracy, with the rest favouring either a Saddam-style dictatorship, or Iranian-style theocracy.

Imposing democracy on people who don't want it is a contradiction in terms, and a recipe for disaster.

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WinterSolstice

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Icon 1 posted March 28, 2007 13:29      Profile for WinterSolstice     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by The Famous Druid:
Interesting article Calli, especially the part where only 43% of Iraqis want a democracy, with the rest favouring either a Saddam-style dictatorship, or Iranian-style theocracy.

Imposing democracy on people who don't want it is a contradiction in terms, and a recipe for disaster.

Well, 43% (if the largest single group) makes a majority.

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An operating system should be like a light switch... simple, effective, easy to use, and designed for everyone.

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The Famous Druid

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Icon 1 posted March 28, 2007 15:59      Profile for The Famous Druid     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by WinterSolstice:
quote:
Originally posted by The Famous Druid:
Imposing democracy on people who don't want it is a contradiction in terms, and a recipe for disaster.

Well, 43% (if the largest single group) makes a majority.
Last time I checked, 'majority' meant 'more than half'.

I believe you're thinking of 'plurality'.

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If you watch 'The History Of NASA' backwards, it's about a space agency that has no manned spaceflight capability, then does low-orbit flights, then lands on the Moon.

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Cap'n Vic

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Icon 1 posted March 28, 2007 17:08      Profile for Cap'n Vic     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by The Famous Druid:
quote:
Originally posted by WinterSolstice:
quote:
Originally posted by The Famous Druid:
Imposing democracy on people who don't want it is a contradiction in terms, and a recipe for disaster.

Well, 43% (if the largest single group) makes a majority.
Last time I checked, 'majority' meant 'more than half'.

I believe you're thinking of 'plurality'.

Majority, like democracy has a different meaning in the US. Just look at the past two elections.
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