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Author Topic: Fahrenhype 9/11
Cap'n Vic

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Icon 1 posted November 02, 2004 00:32      Profile for Cap'n Vic     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
OMFG!!! THat ASM post has got to be the most fscked up thing I have ever read.

His post style is confusing enough, but now he is putting random quotes from threads-gone-by-all over the place, and he has yet to make a single valid point

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(!) (T) = 8-D

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Callipygous
BlabberMouth, a Blabber Odyssey
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Icon 1 posted November 02, 2004 03:00      Profile for Callipygous     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
You might get the impression from ASM that everyone sympathetic to Bush is.. um well.. let's say that his porch light seems to have been flickering for some time. Well here is a well argued calm coherent piece from the conservative perspective, though they do come down in favour of Kerry at the end. Naturally I do not agree with many of the judgements here, but it is refreshing to read something from the other side that is not hysterical, and paints a picture of a world I can actually recognise around me.

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"Knowledge is Power. France is Bacon" - Milton

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ooby
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Icon 1 posted November 02, 2004 06:40      Profile for ooby     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
ASM, it's good that you brought up the bullies analogy. This alternate point of view may allow you to understand the approach that many of those who oppose the war on terrorism take.

Suppose you have a high school. Now suppose the social groups in the school have established a class system resulting in tiers or castes. On top you may have the jocks and on bottom you may have those who do not fit into higher castes. There may be more levels, but they are not needed for this illistration. This class system may not have been intentionally formed for the purpose of suppression, but the inherent properties of such a class system results in suppression of the lower class. Suppose everyday, the upper class oppresses the lower classes in some way. The lowest class is left with basically three options:
1) attempt to climb to a higher social class by assimilation.
2) attemp to climb to a higher social class by eliminating the higher class.
3) remain in the lower class.

Suppose members of the lowest class choose to execute the second option by violent means. They arm themselves to the teeth and try to kill as many people in the higher class as possible. Needless to say, and more often than not, such actions are far from justified.

The view that many take are that in a class system, the higher members have a responsibility to prevent such a scenario. There are two approaches to doing this. One is to find the lower class members who are likely to make violent their actions and use whatever means necessary to prevent that from happening. The other approach is to eliminate the oppression of the lower class, and possibly eliminate the class system as a whole. This would significantly reduce the cause of said violent action.

With respect to the references you made to struggles during the Clinton years, they pale in comparison to the overthrow and attempt at simultaneous nation building of two moderate sized countries. The clostest military operation in size was in Kosovo, which had more multinational support and was smaller in scope and scale that either the operations in Iraq or Afghanistan.

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"haven't you ever wondered if there's more to life than being really, really, rediculously good looking?"

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denny599
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Icon 1 posted June 09, 2005 18:39      Profile for denny599     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Xanthine:
Er, I saw that 100000 figure on the front page of Yahoo! a couple days ago. They uses Biased sources like AP and Reuters though. [Razz]

Ann Coulter scares me.

they were useing rueters it was a servuy team from john hopkins university. here is article about that number. http://slate.msn.com/id/2108887/
note however that number is estimated and is esitmated like this We estimate there were 98,000 extra deaths (95% CI 8000-194 000) during the post-war period. which if your familar with this sort of estimate reporting means john hopkins unvisity is 95% sure war deaths are between 8,000 and 194,000. however http://www.iraqbodycount.net is supported with info from these sources
ABC - ABC News (USA)
AFP - Agence France-Presse
AP - Associated Press
AWST - Aviation Week and Space Technology
Al Jaz - Al Jazeera network
BBC - British Broadcasting Corporation
BG - Boston Globe
Balt. Sun - The Baltimore Sun
CT - Chicago Tribune
CO - Commondreams.org
CSM - Christian Science Monitor
DPA - Deutsche Presse-Agentur
FOX - Fox News
GUA - The Guardian (London)
HRW - Human Rights Watch
HT - Hindustan Times
ICRC - International Committ of the Red Cross
IND - The Independent (London)
IO - Intellnet.org
JT - Jordan Times
LAT - Los Angeles Times
MEN - Middle East Newsline
MEO - Middle East Online
MER - Middle East Report
MH - Miami Herald
NT - Nando Times
NYT - New York Times
Reuters - (includes Reuters Alertnet)
SABC - South African Broadcasting Corporation
SMH - Sydney Morning Herald
Sg.News - The Singapore News
Tel- The Telegraph (London)
Times - The Times (London)
TOI - Times of India
TS - Toronto Star
UPI - United Press International
WNN - World News Network
WP - Washington Post

as you may notice reuter and AP support the 22,000 to 25,000 figure.

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csk

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Icon 1 posted June 09, 2005 18:46      Profile for csk     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
No! If you're going to necropost, choose any thread but this one, please... [shake head]

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6 weeks to go!

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Evendir
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Icon 1 posted June 09, 2005 21:56      Profile for Evendir     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Holy thread resurrection, Batman!
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Alephcat
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Icon 1 posted June 10, 2005 06:54      Profile for Alephcat   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
holy socks!

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"You have the right to search in silence. If you give up the right to search in silence, anything you say can and will be modded down in a court of public opinion."

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garlicguy

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Icon 1 posted June 10, 2005 17:28      Profile for garlicguy   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
"Hypethetically", this thread looks ripe for a pun-fest.

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I don't know what I was thinking... it seemed like a good idea at the time.

Posts: 3752 | From: Pluto, no matter what you call it, is still my home. | Registered: Dec 2004  |  IP: Logged
jordanv
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Icon 1 posted June 10, 2005 19:17      Profile for jordanv     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Michael Moore IS George Bush.

I can't believe you guys haven't seen The Empire Strikes Back yet.

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californiarockr
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Icon 1 posted June 10, 2005 22:50      Profile for californiarockr     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I feel the documentary "Team America: Worl Police" is the most fair, balanced assesment of our country to date.

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lol

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ASM65816
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Icon 11 posted June 11, 2005 09:32      Profile for ASM65816   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
my favorite line from "Team America: World Police"
quote:
Lisa (agent): "You had me at d%cks f*ck a**holes...."
(reference to Jerry Maguire movie)

... and the truth about Kim Jong Il. [Eek!]

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Once a proud programmer of Apple II's, he now spends his days and nights in cheap dives fraternizing with exotic dancers....

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spungo
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Icon 1 posted June 11, 2005 14:18      Profile for spungo     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Dirka dirka Mohammed jihad

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Shameless plug. (Please forgive me.)

Posts: 6529 | From: Noba Scoba | Registered: Jan 2002  |  IP: Logged
flyneye
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Icon 12 posted June 12, 2005 04:01      Profile for flyneye     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Dems,Repubs,left,right.As a Libertarian I see both as brothers from the same family.Same base values,same deceit.
Media:well,like they say,"don't believe what you read,half of what you personally see and NOTHING from the film industry!" (ok,it's what I not they say)

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drunkennewfiemidget
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Icon 1 posted June 12, 2005 08:11      Profile for drunkennewfiemidget     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by flyneye:
Dems,Repubs,left,right.

... is that a code to an unnamed video game?:|
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supergoo

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Icon 1 posted July 13, 2005 14:14      Profile for supergoo     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by drunkennewfiemidget:
quote:
Originally posted by flyneye:
Dems,Repubs,left,right.

... is that a code to an unnamed video game?:|
I think it's the "Become President" cheat code for GTA: Capitol Hill.


[Roll Eyes]

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Y los sueños, sueños son.

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drunkennewfiemidget
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Icon 1 posted July 13, 2005 17:33      Profile for drunkennewfiemidget     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by supergoo:
quote:
Originally posted by drunkennewfiemidget:
quote:
Originally posted by flyneye:
Dems,Repubs,left,right.

... is that a code to an unnamed video game?:|
I think it's the "Become President" cheat code for GTA: Capitol Hill.


[Roll Eyes]

I have a hard time believing there's no bribery involved.
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ChildeRoland
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Icon 1 posted July 13, 2005 19:29      Profile for ChildeRoland     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Deceit 3


How did Bush win Florida? "Second, make sure the chairman of your campaign is also the vote count woman." Actually Florida Secretary of State Katherine Harris (who was Bush's Florida co-chair, not "the chairman") was not the "vote count woman." Vote counting in Florida is performed by the election commissioners in each of Florida's counties. The Florida Secretary of State merely certifies the reported vote. The office does not count votes.



A little while later, Fahrenheit shows Jeffrey Toobin (a sometime talking head lawyer for CNN) claiming that if the Supreme Court had allowed a third recount to proceed past the legal deadline, "under every scenario Gore won the election."



Fahrenheit shows only a snippet of Toobin's remarks on CNN. What Fahrenheit does not show is that Toobin admitted on CNN that the only scenarios for a Gore victory involved a type of recount which Gore had never requested in his lawsuits, and which would have been in violation of Florida law. Toobin's theory likewise depends on re-assigning votes which are plainly marked for one candidate (Pat Buchanan) to Gore, although there are no provisions in Florida law to guess at who a voter "really" meant to vote for and to re-assign the vote.

Gee, that's not deceitful.

quote:
Deceit 5


The movie lauds an anti-Bush riot that took place in Washington, D.C., on the day of Bush’s inauguration. He claims that protestors "pelted Bush's limo with eggs." Actually, it was just one egg, according to the BBC. According to Moore, "No President had ever witnessed such a thing on his inauguration day. " According to CNN, Richard Nixon faced comparable protests in 1969 and 1973. According to USA Today, the anti-Bush organizers claimed that they expected 20,000 protesters to show up, whereas the anti-Nixon protest in 1973 drew 60,000 people. (USA Today, Jan. 20, 2001).

There were wayyy more protestors for Nixon's inaugeration, yet Bush is somehow bad enough to have set precedents with the protests against him.

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Childe Roland

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GMx

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Icon 1 posted July 13, 2005 20:00      Profile for GMx     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Enough already! [Roll Eyes]
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Xanthine

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Icon 1 posted July 13, 2005 21:41      Profile for Xanthine     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Let it die. Just let it die.

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And it's one, two, three / On the wrong side of the lee / What were you meant for? / What were you meant for?
- The Decemberists

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