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Author Topic: Men and Emotions
Rhonwyyn

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Icon 5 posted December 06, 2004 22:16      Profile for Rhonwyyn   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Most of y'all have read about my best friend and my attraction to him and his unattraction to me. So tonight at work one of my co-workers (who is quickly becoming a close friend) pointed out some things about my friend that have been pretty hard to take.

I had decided after last weekend's non-event (he came over during Thanksgiving break and we had a good time; it was just rather uneventful emotionally) that I needed to pursue relationships with other men.

In a last ditch effort to spark something in him, I sent an e-mail apologizing for my demonstrated lack of respect at various points throughout the last two times that we had spent time together. He replied with a kind e-mail, but when my friend/aforementioned co-worker read it, she commented that it sounded like my best friend was trying to be dissociative and unemotional. We talked a bit and came to the conclusion that he is rather unemotional and has never supported what he calls my "emotional roller coaster" and has very grudgingly lent emotional support to me during the difficult times I had this year. My friend warned me to stay away from this guy because his unemotionalism will not change. He doesn't see the value in a relationship with me at this point because he's being rational and logical about it... he's so in control of his emotions that he won't let any strong attachments form with people, including me--the person he calls his first close friend.

So my question is, are all men like this? Are all male geeks like this? My friend is a computer science major at the same university I attended (which is how we met--I was his RA) and a brilliant musician. Is there any hope for him? Is my co-worker/friend correct in warning me to stop waiting for him to grow interested in me?

(In order to help myself withdraw from him, I subscribed to eHarmony this weekend, but I'm having trouble not comparing my matches to the good qualities in my friend. [ohwell] )

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Change the way you SEE, not the way you LOOK!

Posts: 3849 | From: Lancaster, PA | Registered: Jul 2004  |  IP: Logged
Xanthine

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Icon 1 posted December 06, 2004 23:58      Profile for Xanthine     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
No, not all men are like this. Some are emotional roller coasters in and of themselves and others are more in the middle. And stop wasting your time waiting for him and him only. If it's meant to happen it will, but that shouldn't stop you from looking at other options. Or you can just stop looking completely. I have a lot of luck with the latter approach. No one's going to love you before you love yourself.

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And it's one, two, three / On the wrong side of the lee / What were you meant for? / What were you meant for?
- The Decemberists

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Mike M
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Icon 1 posted December 07, 2004 00:14      Profile for Mike M   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Your friend sounds a lot like me a year ago (I'm almost 23).

Until earlier this year, I had never met ladies with enough interests similar to mine to have interest in them, and really never made any effort to go after or attract them. Most of the time, I'm a very level-headed (not outwardly emotional, but I'd show emotion if I were comfortable with the people around me) person, if I'm trying to open up to someone, I'll crack my "Spock impression", but this is very difficult for me, as I'm so used to keeping it in place. A year ago, I was very focused on getting my degree from school...my priorities were (graduate, secure a job, then look for someone...), as a result, a girl would have had to hit me over the head to get me to notice, but I'd like to think I would have responsed to that...

If your friend has ever had a prior relationship, then I agree with your other friend's advice that he's hopeless...but if he hasn't, he may be extremely shy in this area of his life and you're going to have to do more than just make hints about how you feel about him. If he's not willing to open up after that, he's not ready for a relationship with you.

There's nothing wrong with keeping yourself open to him coming to his senses, but you should get on with your life and keep looking as well.

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Mike

"Everyone dies frustrated and sad, and that is beautiful." - Don't Let's Start - They Might Be Giants

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CommanderShroom
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Icon 1 posted December 07, 2004 05:43      Profile for CommanderShroom     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I am not the emotional type of person. Simple. I don't care for extreme feelings at all, they exhaust me. I generally try to stay on an even keel whenever possible. I was born, raised, and continue to stay this way. People have tried to coax emotion from me when I didn't feel or have them the same way. I grew tired quickly and walked away.

edit:
This is not to say I have no emotions. I have plenty. They run deep and strong. My emotions are just not intense.

You seem to be a very emotional person. This can be hard to take, especially if you trying to get him to "come out of his shell." If he has always been low key emotionally he probably always will. You cannot try to prod an emotion from him, he isn't a dog. You can't poke him with a stick and expect him to attack. He will just walk away.

If it is meant to be he will come to you. If it isn't...

Either way, live your life and learn to love yourself. You have a lot of good qualities about you.

--------------------
Does he know our big secret?
Has one of us confessed?
'Bout the wires circuits and motors
Buried in our chest

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Mac D
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Icon 1 posted December 07, 2004 06:03      Profile for Mac D     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
If you want to "Spark" his intrest go to this site get something then invite him over when you are laying on the couch in it. If that does nothing then it's a lost cause.

Note: Link may be somwhat inappropriate for work.

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There's nothing wrong with me, This is how I'm supposed to be.

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drunkennewfiemidget
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Icon 1 posted December 07, 2004 06:36      Profile for drunkennewfiemidget     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I'm much like you. I try too hard to go too deep and too emotionally into a relationship. It seems to backfire on me though, the girls who return it turn out to be the crazy ones I don't end up wanting to be with, and the ones that keep their distance and won't let themselves get caught up in it are the ones I'd have liked to. Such is life.

I'd suggest just being happy with yourself, forget about him, he's a lost cause. Move on. Find someone that it works with.

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angryjungman

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Icon 1 posted December 07, 2004 09:00      Profile for angryjungman   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
This guy sounds a lot like me. I'd definitely look around for something more your speed emotionally. It can be intensely frustrating if one person in the relationship is more outwardly emotional than the other. Just ask any of my numerous ex-girlfriends.

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Meh.

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Xanthine

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Icon 1 posted December 07, 2004 09:16      Profile for Xanthine     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Heh. I'm not too outwardly emotional either, and I'm a girl. Most guys don't have problems with this, though there was one boyfriend who just couldn't handle my steadfast grip on my "emotional independence". The thing is, I'm really not naturally inclined to be as rock-stable as I had to be in that relationship. I feel deep and it can boil over, but with that guy I kept the lid on pretty tight. He was such an emotional loose cannon that I had to. Someone's gotta be the anchor and he couldn't do it.

Since then I've dated very nice and stable men who sit back and let me rant. It's nice to be able to induldge in a bad mood every now and then.

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And it's one, two, three / On the wrong side of the lee / What were you meant for? / What were you meant for?
- The Decemberists

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CommanderShroom
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Icon 1 posted December 07, 2004 11:22      Profile for CommanderShroom     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Mac D:
If you want to "Spark" his intrest go to this site

From what I know about Rhonwyyn, I don't belive that is the interest she is looking for.

Though I may show that site to my wife.
[Big Grin]

--------------------
Does he know our big secret?
Has one of us confessed?
'Bout the wires circuits and motors
Buried in our chest

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Mac D
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Icon 1 posted December 07, 2004 12:22      Profile for Mac D     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by CommanderShroom:
quote:
Originally posted by Mac D:
If you want to "Spark" his intrest go to this site

From what I know about Rhonwyyn, I don't belive that is the interest she is looking for.

Though I may show that site to my wife.
[Big Grin]

See I usually get stuff for my wife from that site. After all I know what I want to see her in [Wink]

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There's nothing wrong with me, This is how I'm supposed to be.

Posts: 1449 | From: Where I am is very relative to my location at that time. | Registered: Sep 2004  |  IP: Logged
csk

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Icon 1 posted December 07, 2004 15:30      Profile for csk     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
So my question is, are all men like this? Are all male geeks like this?
No, definitely not. Each man is different, much like each female is different. Not knowing the guy, it's hard to analyse why he in particular is like this. It could be as "simple" as he has a belief that he should only have an emotionally involving relationship with someone who he's intent on pursuing a relationship with. This belief is fairly common for a lot of Christian guys, especially ones in a relationship already (since emotional involvement with someone other than your partner can turn into more).


quote:

My friend is a computer science major at the same university I attended (which is how we met--I was his RA) and a brilliant musician. Is there any hope for him? Is my co-worker/friend correct in warning me to stop waiting for him to grow interested in me?

I'm sure there's plenty of hope for him, but I wouldn't be hanging around waiting for him. Plus, there's a chance that if you become less interested in him, he may become more interested in you (paradox, I know, but it's happened to me. But then, I used to act like a real dork around anyone I had a crush on).

quote:
In order to help myself withdraw from him, I subscribed to eHarmony this weekend, but I'm having trouble not comparing my matches to the good qualities in my friend.
That's not surprising. I'd try to divide your wishlist of good qualities into two categories "must have" and "nice to have" (you could also do "must not have" and "would prefer not to have" for bad qualities, I guess). That might make it sound like a job interview, but you don't want to realise down the track that the guy is missing some essential quality that they didn't know was essential, and for you to be telling him frequently that you never should have married him and that he'll never be able to make you happy.

Oops, slight tangent (true story, though, unfortunately [Frown] ). Consider also how those qualities complement your own strengths and weaknesses.

In any case, I wish you the best of luck in your search. Go get em!

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6 weeks to go!

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Rhonwyyn

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Icon 1 posted December 07, 2004 16:17      Profile for Rhonwyyn   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Thanks for all of your input, y'all. Somehow, though I'm dead set on getting him out of my system right now (why does "South Pacific" pop into my head?), I know he'll do something in the next few weeks to persuade me otherwise. I'll just have to stick to my guns, I guess.

Taking CSK up on his advice, here's my list of must haves:

Christian, sense of humor, normal intelligence, music appreciation, patience, wisdom, affection, verbal/emotional intimacy, strength of character, creativity, and maturity.

Should have:
high intelligence, play at least one musical instrument, understanding of computers, spontaneous, high grasp of grammar, spelling, and syntax, love for children and strong sense of positive discipline.

Must not:
Smoke, drink to excess (if at all), act with disrespect, lack compassion, be unemotional, show restraint 100% of the time, focus on outward appearances to the exclusion of others/self/attention to inward appearances, lack intelligence or work ethic, use vulgar/profane language, flirt/tease other women or men.

If y'all have any ideas to add/subtract, let me know! [Smile]

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Change the way you SEE, not the way you LOOK!

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CommanderShroom
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Icon 1 posted December 07, 2004 16:31      Profile for CommanderShroom     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Hmmm,

Sounds perfect, too perfect. You may have to go back to school and learn how to sequence DNA for that one. [Wink]

Honestly, you might get some, probably not all.

Perhaps we can make one of those Pros and Cons charts. Remeber like the anal person on all sitcoms makes. [Big Grin]

--------------------
Does he know our big secret?
Has one of us confessed?
'Bout the wires circuits and motors
Buried in our chest

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Rhonwyyn

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Icon 1 posted December 07, 2004 16:41      Profile for Rhonwyyn   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Ahh, Shroomy, you're earning a soft spot in my heart with all of your niceness tonight. Thanks! [Smile]

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Change the way you SEE, not the way you LOOK!

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csk

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Icon 1 posted December 07, 2004 16:42      Profile for csk     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Umm, you've got a "must have" high intelligence and a "should have" normal intelligence. There's a problem in itself [Wink]

Actually, if I take that list and apply it to the eligible guys I know, none of them fit the mold exactly. I know one who's probably there on most fronts except the musical side (appreciates music, but is tone deaf). So the list might need a little work to avoid over-pickiness. If you were to be together with this person, how would them having this trait tangibly benefit or be a detriment to your relationship? Could it be worked around, or developed?

The scary part is that I've personally encountered a list almost identical to this before.

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6 weeks to go!

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Rhonwyyn

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Icon 1 posted December 07, 2004 17:02      Profile for Rhonwyyn   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Oops, you're right, CSK. I need to switch those two intelligences thing. Edit: DONE.

I'm not sure why you're concerned about the music appreciation thing. Music is such a big part of my life that my partner absolutely must appreciate music. 'Twould be a bonus if he actually played an instrument or could run sound or something like that so that we could perform together (at the very least make music together--a strong connection for me, hard to explain). Does that make sense?

I really doubt that my list is too much to expect. I know men hold women to high standards too.

EDIT: I was tone deaf until I studied viola beginning in sixth grade. My strings teacher taught me to solfege and hear tones/pitches. I'm a pro at vocal harmonization now. [Smile]

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Change the way you SEE, not the way you LOOK!

Posts: 3849 | From: Lancaster, PA | Registered: Jul 2004  |  IP: Logged
csk

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Icon 1 posted December 07, 2004 17:16      Profile for csk     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Rhonwyyn:
I'm not sure why you're concerned about the music appreciation thing. Music is such a big part of my life that my partner absolutely must appreciate music. 'Twould be a bonus if he actually played an instrument or could run sound or something like that so that we could perform together (at the very least make music together--a strong connection for me, hard to explain). Does that make sense?

So, if I were to hazard a guess, you get a huge emotional buzz from being involved in the playing of music, and you would like someone who knows what that is like and can experience that with you.

I thought my almost-ex-wife was the only one with that criteria (but even more strongly), but it would appear I was wrong.

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6 weeks to go!

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Xanthine

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Icon 1 posted December 07, 2004 17:34      Profile for Xanthine     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Rhonwyyn:
EDIT: I was tone deaf until I studied viola beginning in sixth grade. My strings teacher taught me to solfege and hear tones/pitches. I'm a pro at vocal harmonization now. [Smile]

That sounds freakishly like me... Though I'm way too out of practice to call myself a pro.

Well, you can take some heart in this Rhonnie. I'm seeing a guy who fits almost all your criteria save the Christian bit. So they do exist. You just have to find one. His spelling and grammar aren't terrific either, but then again, English is not his first language.

Strangely enough, I don't have a list. I just sorta bang into people and listen for that clicking sound that happens when compatible minds meet. Though I wouldn't want to date a smoker. or a fellow biochemist. That would be like dating a brother.

Edit: Aw hell, here's my list:
Must have (and this is not prioritized):
* a brain
* ability to carry on a conversation
* an open mind
* a sense of adventure
* independence (I'm pretty independent in just about every way you can think of, and I've found that the people best able to deal with me are the same)
* a wicked sense of humor
* patience
* honesty
* love for animals
* interest in music
* respect for self and others
* sense of responsibility
* kindness
That might seem like a lot, but when I'm not looking I seem to find guys with these qualities. Or they find me. Whatev.

Must not have:
* the antithesis of anything on the above list
* undealt-with major mental issues. That may seem politically incorrect, discriminatory, etc., but I had a bf who had clinical depression that he wasn't interested in treating and it sucked big time. If you're on top of your problems, great. If you're still blaming everyone else and refusing help and making life around you hell, I'm not interested. I've been there, done that, and I'm not doing it again.
* a condescending attitude towards women
* an overly large ego
* a sociopathic interpretation of right and wrong
* any sort of extremist beliefs. Fundamentalists and extremists scare the crap out of me.
* lots of hate and bitterness. Once again, scares the crap out of me.

--------------------
And it's one, two, three / On the wrong side of the lee / What were you meant for? / What were you meant for?
- The Decemberists

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Rhonwyyn

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Icon 1 posted December 07, 2004 19:08      Profile for Rhonwyyn   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Great list, Xanthine!

As for the "stop looking and it'll find you" opinion, weeelll....

The spring of my junior year in university I had decided that I didn't need a boyfriend and that life was great as a single. Another RA introduced me to a man on his floor who I ran into later at the bus stop after one of his art classes. He invited me to stop by to see his paintings, so when I was on rounds one night I stopped in to see him.

We quickly formed a friendship due to our common interests in Christ, the Gaithers, trains, the medical field, art, and music. About the third time we hung out I mentioned that I wanted to rearrange my room. He volunteered to do it 'cause he was good at that kind of thing (I lived in a very small room in a very nice residence hall).

I like to say that he rearranged my room, then rearranged my life, 'cause later on that evening he asked about my views on dating, then told me that he wanted to date me. Because I wasn't actively searching for a boyfriend at that time, I was caught off-guard and figured that God must have been rewarding me for my patience and that I should date that man. Thus began a whirlwind three weeks.

It turned out that the artist, a former EMT turned first-year art major with pierced ears and a 12-year headstart, had been in prison for about five years because of supplying pornography to minors. He became a Christian in prison; he also discovered his talent for painting in prison (in all honesty, he is a superb artist). Also, before entering prison, he developed an addiction to prescription narcotics as a result of working as an EMT in Philadelphia.

The first week was great. We saw each other about every day, went on our first "date" to his church on a Saturday evening to see Chiz Ryder perform, and spent a lot of time talking and just spending time together. I would take my homework over to his room in the evenings and work on it while he painted. 'Twas a great arrangement. He also had me try on his ring for size and hinted to his mother that he might be getting engaged in a few months. I should've heeded the warning signs.

Then things started to unravel. He went in for an emergency root canal and had some bad days because he couldn't take any pain killers (non-narcotics weren't effective and narcotics gave awful side effects) and took it out on me since I was available. Oh, did I mention that I was his first girlfriend since before he went to prison?

The next weekend we spent Easter at his church and had lunch with his family: his mother who was sweet, his grandmother who didn't really notice me 'cause of her age, and his father (a formerly brilliant engineer with Alzheimers stemming from an accident at work) who acted confused about me being there. My boyfriend treated me rather coldly during all of it. His response? "I was just testing you. I wanted to see how you'd react."

The next weekend he drove me home for an orthodontist appointment because he insisted that he had promised me he would do it and he didn't break his promises. Friday night he broke up with me at my family's dinner table. We had an all-right weekend and whereas the trip home was tense, the trip back to school was relaxed and fun.

It took me a few months to get over this guy. Looking back I don't really see why, but I think I put too much emphasis into our similar interests/values and the timing of our relationship. He did set a precedent for future relationships, though. One night he told me some of the things that he observed about me: that I always pull down my shirt when I stand up, that I duck my head when complimented, that my eyes lit up when he walked into the room. My current best friend (or should I say formerly current best friend?), if he's been observant like that, hasn't let on.

(Wow, I didn't realize I had written so much! I'd edit, but I don't know what I'd cut. :-/)

I guess because of all of that I've decided to be more proactive in my search for a relationship. I want a courtship to be deliberate, with rules and defined goals/objectives, prescribed behaviors and the like. Yet, I also want a relaxed environment with a lot of fun and flexing of the lines at times.

Clear as mud?

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Change the way you SEE, not the way you LOOK!

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csk

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Icon 1 posted December 07, 2004 19:36      Profile for csk     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Hmm, that silence must be all the men on GC muttering to themselves "Well, I don't measure up to either of those lists" [Wink]

Seriously, though...
quote:

I guess because of all of that I've decided to be more proactive in my search for a relationship. I want a courtship to be deliberate, with rules and defined goals/objectives, prescribed behaviors and the like. Yet, I also want a relaxed environment with a lot of fun and flexing of the lines at times.

This sounds like a good balance to me. You want to make sure someone meets your requirements (by evaluating them against "the list" or whatever else), but you don't want to be spending so much time evaluating that you never enjoy yourself and each other.

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6 weeks to go!

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CommanderShroom
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Icon 1 posted December 07, 2004 19:50      Profile for CommanderShroom     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Yep I don't live up to either one.

I am just your average obnoxious male. With enough good traits to hide the bad until you actually get to know me. [evil]

--------------------
Does he know our big secret?
Has one of us confessed?
'Bout the wires circuits and motors
Buried in our chest

Posts: 2463 | From: Utarrrrggggghhh!!!!!!!! | Registered: Mar 2003  |  IP: Logged
Rhonwyyn

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Icon 1 posted December 07, 2004 20:24      Profile for Rhonwyyn   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Which of course makes you realize, Dearest Shroomy, that even if you were single and lived in my quadrasphere, I'd never date you. [Razz]

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Change the way you SEE, not the way you LOOK!

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dragonman97

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Icon 1 posted December 07, 2004 21:03      Profile for dragonman97   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
/me just fears that he's in the bad column under one or two of the above posts *shrug*.

Ahhhh...screw it...back to Perl go I. Whatever will be, will be -- I think Xanthine's quite right about that. Hell, I'm not even trying, and get pretty decent treatment at my local coffee house. [Wink] *Perhaps* it's the fact that I'm sometimes writing Perl (on paper) while I'm there. [Big Grin]

$i->heart('Perl');

/me returns to writing a fun program in vim...

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There are three things you can be sure of in life: Death, taxes, and reading about fake illnesses online...

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Rhonwyyn

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Icon 1 posted December 07, 2004 22:06      Profile for Rhonwyyn   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Ehh, dman, it's just the facial hair that I don't like. [Razz]

Oh yeah, forgot to add that to my list... the only comment I'll make about physical appearance (taller than me is a good thing)--mustn't have much facial hair. I've never liked beards or mustaches. Goatees, soul patches (on some men), or long sideburns are okay, but it really depends on the man.

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Change the way you SEE, not the way you LOOK!

Posts: 3849 | From: Lancaster, PA | Registered: Jul 2004  |  IP: Logged
csk

Member # 1941

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Icon 1 posted December 07, 2004 22:15      Profile for csk     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
But don't goatees usually involve moustaches as a side effect? Hmm...

I notice that no guys have been bold enough to post an equivalent list. I know for myself that I honestly don't know what I'd put on it (other than a few basics). Is anyone else finding the same thing?

Edit: This couldn't go unsaid...
quote:
Originally posted by dragonman97:
Hell, I'm not even trying, and get pretty decent treatment at my local coffee house. [Wink] . *Perhaps* it's the fact that I'm sometimes writing Perl (on paper) while I'm there. [Big Grin]

You'd probably have more luck if it was Python. Besides, the time you'd save you could use for chasing baristas [Wink]

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6 weeks to go!

Posts: 4455 | From: Sydney, Australia | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged


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