homeGeek CultureWebstoreeCards!Forums!Joy of Tech!AY2K!webcam

The Geek Culture Forums


Post New Topic  New Poll  Post A Reply
my profile | directory login | | search | faq | forum home
  next oldest topic   next newest topic
» The Geek Culture Forums   » Other Geeky Stuff   » Ask a Geek!   » iMac boot problems.

 - UBBFriend: Email this page to someone!    
Author Topic: iMac boot problems.
TheMoMan
BlabberMouth, a Blabber Odyssey
Member # 1659

Member Rated:
4
Icon 1 posted March 19, 2006 13:56      Profile for TheMoMan         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Dman, Capt'n Vic, or DNF_______________Help is there an open firmware command that will let me use a non Apple CD-Rom to install or start up from. I have a very early iMac I mean early 233Mhz it has been a work horse but about three years ago the CD-Rom left the buiding. I could use it to inter more data but could not boot or start up from it. I am using OS 9,2 and it is becoming so corrupt that boot time is exceeding 7 minutes, how do I get around the non Apple CD-Rom. It does not have SCSI or firewire only the early USB that it will not boot from. Any Ideas?

--------------------
Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.


Benjamin Franklin,

Posts: 5848 | From: Just South of the Huron National Forest, in the water shed of the Rifle River | Registered: Sep 2002  |  IP: Logged
CommanderShroom
BlabberMouth, a Blabber Odyssey
Member # 2097

Member Rated:
4
Icon 1 posted March 19, 2006 14:44      Profile for CommanderShroom     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
MoMan,

It may be better to replace the drive. Rather than spend money on an external. Just grab a toolkit and tear away.

Here is an eBay listing for an iMac drive I just found.

and here's a listing for a firmware update for the iMac drive.

One or both may help you out.

--------------------
Does he know our big secret?
Has one of us confessed?
'Bout the wires circuits and motors
Buried in our chest

Posts: 2465 | From: Utarrrrggggghhh!!!!!!!! | Registered: Mar 2003  |  IP: Logged
macmcseboy

Solid Nitrozanium SuperFan!
Member # 1232

Member Rated:
4
Icon 1 posted March 19, 2006 15:49      Profile for macmcseboy     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
If i can dig one out that works I'll send ya one for the cost of shipping...

--------------------
Live long and prosper.

Posts: 1139 | From: Victoria BC... | Registered: Mar 2002  |  IP: Logged
TheMoMan
BlabberMouth, a Blabber Odyssey
Member # 1659

Member Rated:
4
Icon 1 posted March 19, 2006 16:03      Profile for TheMoMan         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I have been using an ATA CD-ROM from NEC it will work for reading photo CD's but I can't boot from it. Therefore I can't run any repairs on the system folder.

--------------------
Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.


Benjamin Franklin,

Posts: 5848 | From: Just South of the Huron National Forest, in the water shed of the Rifle River | Registered: Sep 2002  |  IP: Logged
Serenak

Member # 2950

Member Rated:
4
Icon 1 posted March 19, 2006 16:28      Profile for Serenak     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Do you have any other Macs Mo Man or just the one?

If you have more than one you could probably copy a clean (or at least working) System over a network from that renaming the old system folder in the process and then build up from that

Disk First Aid or Norton or Tech Tool might be able to fix some problems even with the old system running which might help

Alternatively you could try turning off just about all the control panels and extensions and seeing how it goes - adding a few back into the mix at a time. You might at least find the source of the slowdown that way - often there are a lot of extensions running that you may not actually need on a solo Mac - just a suggestion.

--------------------
"So if you want my address - it's No. 1 at the end of the bar, where I sit with the broken angels, clutching at straws and nursing my scars..."

Posts: 1937 | From: Suffolk England | Registered: Sep 2004  |  IP: Logged
TheMoMan
BlabberMouth, a Blabber Odyssey
Member # 1659

Member Rated:
4
Icon 1 posted March 19, 2006 17:56      Profile for TheMoMan         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Serenak_________________There in lies the rub, All of the old macs are old world, the iMac is the only new world, I guess I could bring the supermac in from the barn and hookit up to the router, I wish that the iMac had SCSI then I would have it made in the shade. Some of my buddys don't know or understand SCSI and can not understand why I use it. but I like its speed compared to ATA 66. Even my Ubuntu box is SCSI. Back to the iMac problem it goes through all of the Extenstions quite well, it is after the wallpaper is loaded and the finder is loading the launcher that it slows down.

--------------------
Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.


Benjamin Franklin,

Posts: 5848 | From: Just South of the Huron National Forest, in the water shed of the Rifle River | Registered: Sep 2002  |  IP: Logged
dragonman97

SuperFan!
Member # 780

Member Rated:
4
Icon 1 posted March 19, 2006 18:05      Profile for dragonman97   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
If any of the old Macs have Firewire, hook the iMac up to them, and boot it into Firewire Target mode. Then muck about with it that way. I don't actually know how to make the Mac bootable beyond that - p'raps a Mac guru can offer some more assistance?

--------------------
There are three things you can be sure of in life: Death, taxes, and reading about fake illnesses online...

Posts: 9332 | From: Westchester County, New York | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
MacManKrisK

Gold Hearted SuperFan!
Member # 955

Member Rated:
5
Icon 1 posted March 19, 2006 22:22      Profile for MacManKrisK     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
This is convoluted.... fair warning.

How much RAM does that sucker have?? Boot off the HD, Create a RAM disk (Memory Control Panel) leaving at least 16MB free for the system to use, but hopefully 24 or 32, install a SUPER-MINIMAL System Folder on the RAM Disk, reboot off the RAM Disk, use the CD to install a new System Folder on the HD.

For creating the SUPER-MINIMAL system folder, I'd make a new folder on the HD, then Option-Drag these items into it: Finder, System, Text Encoding Converter (from Extensions), Apple CD/DVD (or whatever CD driver extensions you need), Startup Disk (from Control Panels), and any other extensions/control panels you absolutely need to boot (Mac people? did I miss any? it's been too long since I've messed with OS 9!). Then copy that new folder to the RAM Disk, rename it System Folder, and make sure it's blessed (it should have a little Mac-smiley face on it). If it isn't blessed, drag the Finder file from the System Folder to the root level of the RAM Disk, then drag it back into the System Folder.

Alternatively, I would just try booting off the hard drive, running Installer off the CD and telling it to do a Clean Install by clicking the Options... button at the bottom of the Installer. Unless I'm missing something, it shouldn't have a problem with that (but, like I said, it's been a long time). YMMV, IRAH

--------------------
"Buy low, sell high
get rich and you still die"


Posts: 2331 | From: Southwest Michigan, USA | Registered: Oct 2001  |  IP: Logged
TheMoMan
BlabberMouth, a Blabber Odyssey
Member # 1659

Member Rated:
4
Icon 1 posted March 20, 2006 04:40      Profile for TheMoMan         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
MacManKrisK______________Well I'm setting up this machine for the Mrs in case I end up with a dead iMac. I once tried putting a copy of the disk tools floppy in the second partion and booting from that. That worked except that I could not run repair disk because in effect it was on the same hard drive that it was trying to repair, I am going to load the disk tools into Ram Disk and then see if the installer will be darkened when I attempt to reinstall. I do remember that one should start from the install CD or floppies to reinstall. Oh by the way that little sucker has 320Megs of ram so I have plenty or room to make a Ram Disk. And Dman no I do not have a single machine with firewire (*@*%%@*) that would be so much better.

--------------------
Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.


Benjamin Franklin,

Posts: 5848 | From: Just South of the Huron National Forest, in the water shed of the Rifle River | Registered: Sep 2002  |  IP: Logged
Serenak

Member # 2950

Member Rated:
4
Icon 1 posted March 20, 2006 06:15      Profile for Serenak     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Why not try killing the Launcher MoMan? I never used Launcher myself - just had a folder full of aliases (which is effectively the same thing, especially if you set it to Button View)

It could just be that slowing it down - and you are looking to crack a walnut with the proverbial Jackhammer.

Yes I miss SCSI too - and the early iMacs fall in the gap having neither SCSI nor Firewire which can get you into the difficult position you find yourself in...

I can probably use www.yousendit.com to send you a basic 9.2.2 New World OS to use as a base if you are really stuck

PM me if you need anything

--------------------
"So if you want my address - it's No. 1 at the end of the bar, where I sit with the broken angels, clutching at straws and nursing my scars..."

Posts: 1937 | From: Suffolk England | Registered: Sep 2004  |  IP: Logged
TheMoMan
BlabberMouth, a Blabber Odyssey
Member # 1659

Member Rated:
4
Icon 1 posted March 20, 2006 07:24      Profile for TheMoMan         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Serenak__________________I will try killing the launcher, however during startup when it is hanging there if one does a force quit, the question that comes up is do I want to force quit the finder, I do not know if the finder or the Launcher is the true culprit.

--------------------
Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.


Benjamin Franklin,

Posts: 5848 | From: Just South of the Huron National Forest, in the water shed of the Rifle River | Registered: Sep 2002  |  IP: Logged
Serenak

Member # 2950

Member Rated:
4
Icon 1 posted March 20, 2006 14:40      Profile for Serenak     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Mo Man

Launcher may or may not be the culprit but in my experience (esp. in OS 9 or previous) the culprit will cause the Finder to hang thus giving the impression that the Finder is at fault... Even in OS X I have had Apps hang by clogging the Finder and at the worst with the Finder down even Apple Option Esc won't respond and only a power down works... Word vx and its dislike for Suitcase was a very prime candidate for this in earlier OSX versions and at one time there was no way I could open Quark and Word simultaneously as it would hang Suitcase and that would hang Finder...

Anyway Finder is quite possibly not the problem... kill Launcher and see how that goes. If Finder still gives grief try the extensions off "safe boot" (hold down shift on start up) and see if that runs OK - if it does then the System and Finder are probably basically sound and you have the "Classic Extension Clash Hell" and you are back to where I was earlier...

Kill all Extensions and Control Panels and feed them back in one at a time until the problem reoccurs...

If the extension is something you don't need right now put it on the "disabled list" and see how it goes from there

If you still fear corruption in the Finder my previous offer still stands...

BTW - if you have 2 partitions on your HD and start from Partition 2 with a min system (disk tools or whatever) that should not stop you running repair on Partition 1. That is the whole point of multiple partitions as i understand it and something I have used to deal with problems like you describe more than once...

--------------------
"So if you want my address - it's No. 1 at the end of the bar, where I sit with the broken angels, clutching at straws and nursing my scars..."

Posts: 1937 | From: Suffolk England | Registered: Sep 2004  |  IP: Logged
MacManKrisK

Gold Hearted SuperFan!
Member # 955

Member Rated:
5
Icon 1 posted March 20, 2006 21:19      Profile for MacManKrisK     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Going with the "culprits that point their finger falsely at the Finder" theme: Delete the "AppleShare Prep," "Finder Preferences," "System Preferences," "Users & Groups Data File," and "Apple Menu Options Prefs" files in the Preferences folder inside the System Folder. They'll get recreated, but if any are corrupt, they'll cause problems.

--------------------
"Buy low, sell high
get rich and you still die"


Posts: 2331 | From: Southwest Michigan, USA | Registered: Oct 2001  |  IP: Logged
TheMoMan
BlabberMouth, a Blabber Odyssey
Member # 1659

Member Rated:
4
Icon 1 posted March 21, 2006 09:56      Profile for TheMoMan         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
To all whom tried to help, thanks. I have managed to get to non bootable now. I even put the drive in the supermac (UMAX) and reformatted and reloaded OS9 put it back into the iMac it will not boot from that drive, I am now trieng to score a an Apple branded CD-ROM so I can do a save the machine doesn't really owe us any thing it just is The Mrs MoMans favorite.

--------------------
Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.


Benjamin Franklin,

Posts: 5848 | From: Just South of the Huron National Forest, in the water shed of the Rifle River | Registered: Sep 2002  |  IP: Logged
Serenak

Member # 2950

Member Rated:
4
Icon 1 posted March 21, 2006 15:15      Profile for Serenak     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Before you dump too much cash remember you can get a good later rev iMac on ebay for very little these days

One with a bigger HD and possible DVD and definitely Firewire

Trouble is the SuperMac will have installed an Old World compatible OS 9 most likely - and as you said you need a New World one

Those rev A iMacs are a bit of a pain really - not up to modern specs, yet not true Classic machines - the Beige G3 suffers the same fate

[Frown]

Get a newer one and you could move up to at least 10.3.9 and take it from me that would really be worth it - and possibly cost less than the CD and maybe a HD should you need one

To be honest I had a client's "difficult revA iMac here at the weekend... and I did get it going with some difficulty but it has a possible HW problem (intermittent refusal to start up) and I told him he could buy a much later and better spec one on ebay for less than any repairs would cost...

RevA iMacs are to be frank not usually worth the effort now - if they go south go get a later one. Especially if HW is involved.

--------------------
"So if you want my address - it's No. 1 at the end of the bar, where I sit with the broken angels, clutching at straws and nursing my scars..."

Posts: 1937 | From: Suffolk England | Registered: Sep 2004  |  IP: Logged
TheMoMan
BlabberMouth, a Blabber Odyssey
Member # 1659

Member Rated:
4
Icon 1 posted March 22, 2006 04:23      Profile for TheMoMan         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
iMac_________________Health, I have accomplished makeing it non-bootable. I copyed a system folder to the second partion, still within the first 8Gigs and set Startup Disk to that folder. It starts fine and displays this message, You can not start from a copy of the system folder only from the oridginal media, or to that effect. I went looking at Shreve Systems I could buy a compleat RevD for what I could get a new in the box CD-ROM for. The Stepson says he may have an Apple branded CD somewhere it just will take some time to find.

--------------------
Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.


Benjamin Franklin,

Posts: 5848 | From: Just South of the Huron National Forest, in the water shed of the Rifle River | Registered: Sep 2002  |  IP: Logged
Serenak

Member # 2950

Member Rated:
4
Icon 1 posted March 22, 2006 16:37      Profile for Serenak     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
A newer iMac (Rev D or whatever) would be the sanest bet unless you can get it going for nix $$$$

--------------------
"So if you want my address - it's No. 1 at the end of the bar, where I sit with the broken angels, clutching at straws and nursing my scars..."

Posts: 1937 | From: Suffolk England | Registered: Sep 2004  |  IP: Logged
macmcseboy

Solid Nitrozanium SuperFan!
Member # 1232

Member Rated:
4
Icon 1 posted March 22, 2006 23:41      Profile for macmcseboy     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
/me pipes up again

I may have one iMac CD_ROM in my collection of stuff...

i will check and see.

--------------------
Live long and prosper.

Posts: 1139 | From: Victoria BC... | Registered: Mar 2002  |  IP: Logged
Chesty
Assimilated
Member # 2460

Member Rated:
2
Icon 1 posted March 23, 2006 21:40      Profile for Chesty         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I have one such Imac (333 I belive - It's blue) works great but ethernet went out since it's on the mobo - plplpltttt!

You could probably get a usb adapter to get it online. My wife will be glad if I get it out of her office. Cheap Cheap and whatever the shipping.

I just dumped a green imac with a bad cdrom (i found out it was bad after changing the startup disc to it) I never did get it going.

Posts: 416 | From: The Beach | Registered: Nov 2003  |  IP: Logged


All times are Eastern Time  
Post New Topic  New Poll  Post A Reply Close Topic    Move Topic    Delete Topic next oldest topic   next newest topic
 - Printer-friendly view of this topic
Hop To:

Contact Us | Geek Culture Home Page

2015 Geek Culture

Powered by Infopop Corporation
UBB.classicTM 6.4.0



homeGeek CultureWebstoreeCards!Forums!Joy of Tech!AY2K!webcam