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Posted by dragonman97 (Member # 780) on September 30, 2013, 21:24:
 
Curious question to non-US folks: Just how bonkers does our system look right now?

This whole debacle is really frustrating - holding the gov't and possible the full faith and credit of our nation hostage over a law that was /passed into law/...is an utter disgrace. If anyone should have their pay withheld, it's them, not innocent everyday employees.
 
Posted by TheMoMan (Member # 1659) on September 30, 2013, 23:04:
 
D-man, because this may be read by non-adults, I will leave out the profanity, I do not have anything to say.

I some times watch a PBS station that broadcasts foreign news some of them are have great fun with the news feeds.
 
Posted by The Famous Druid (Member # 1769) on October 01, 2013, 02:42:
 
Looks like the Republicans put Roy in charge of fixing the US government...
 -
 
Posted by The Famous Druid (Member # 1769) on October 01, 2013, 02:50:
 
But seriously, it looks like the Republicans are pushing the 'One Year Delay' thingo because they're looking towards the next congressional election, where they can either...
1. Campaign as the party who will stop Obamacare gassing your granny
or
2. Looks like chicken little the day after the sky didn't fall, while trying to convince millions of people who have health insurance for the first time ever to vote to give it up.
 
Posted by dragonman97 (Member # 780) on October 01, 2013, 02:56:
 
quote:
Originally posted by The Famous Druid:
Looks like the Republicans put Roy in charge of fixing the US government...
 -

Thanks, I needed that. [Big Grin]
(That elicited an actual LOL.)
 
Posted by Snaggy (Member # 123) on October 01, 2013, 04:21:
 
dman, it looks terrible from up here in Canada. I can't imagine how frustrating it must be to live in the USA right now.

And what is scary for us is how much the [crazy] [crazy] [crazy] wrecking your country affects our country here, and the rest of the world.

[shake head]
 
Posted by TheMoMan (Member # 1659) on October 01, 2013, 07:45:
 
Think about!

Mz S. Palin of Alaska fame and her comments about death panels, we have them already. Blue Cross, Aetna, Humana, "We Are Sorry, That Is Not a Covered Benifit."
 
Posted by spungo (Member # 1089) on October 01, 2013, 09:41:
 
quote:
Originally posted by dragonman97:
Just how bonkers does our system look right now?

Nah, just the tea-baggers -- they're loons, and everyone can see that. They think they have the right to bypass democracy. The 'normal' wing of the Republican party really should disown them, but they can't 'cos they have too many supporters -- deranged folk from the square states who still think Obama is an Ay-rab.
 
Posted by TheMoMan (Member # 1659) on October 01, 2013, 10:11:
 
Actually I think it is RACIAL PROFILING by the Old Angry White Men, whose great hope was beaten.
 
Posted by CommanderShroom (Member # 2097) on October 01, 2013, 11:04:
 
It is frustrating and irritating thing all the way around.

Currently I place the blame on the House for allowing this to continue. They are holding a gun to our head in order to shut down the ACA.

I know that I have espoused a lot of Libertarian rhetoric, and in many ways I still believe in many of the same things. This is not Libertarian. This is sociopathic.

The blame I place on the moderates and the current sitting president is that these factions should have been put in their place years ago. But they placated them and all it did was feed fuel to their fire.

I have faith that things will get figured out. Eventually. [ohwell] But I hope that the Senate doesn't budge. The last thing we need is to give the nutjobs like Cruz another reason to think that he is in the right. Our system is a mess, but these hardliners are something to fear.
 
Posted by TheMoMan (Member # 1659) on October 04, 2013, 12:44:
 
I am wondering how long before big business gets on the phone and tells the congress to go back to work.
 
Posted by TheMoMan (Member # 1659) on October 05, 2013, 09:51:
 
To those of you that have access to DirecTV, channel 347 is now Al Jazeera

Of course they are covering the pain of effected people.
 
Posted by The Famous Druid (Member # 1769) on October 05, 2013, 12:23:
 
<sings>
Super callous right-wing cynics stuffing up the process,
Just because they like to think Obamacare's atrocious...
</sings>
 
Posted by MacManKrisK (Member # 955) on October 05, 2013, 12:39:
 
quote:
Originally posted by The Famous Druid:
<sings>
Super callous right-wing cynics stuffing up the process,
Just because they like to think Obamacare's atrocious...
</sings>

[Applause]
 
Posted by Snaggy (Member # 123) on October 05, 2013, 13:18:
 
Druid.. lol! [Applause]

MacManKrisK!!!!!!! [Applause]
 
Posted by Serenak (Member # 2950) on October 05, 2013, 20:31:
 
Every country has its own idiocies...

The US seems to have this one where the debt is continuously rising - perhaps soon to the point where all the money in the whole world economy wouldn't cover it. Topped off with a silly thing where it sets a "no more borrowing" level and then everything stops while the parties wrangle and horse trade trying to gain advantages before they eventually decide to raise the borrowing ceiling a few more trillions and then carry on until it happens again.

From here in the UK it just looks silly and even Obama said (in a soundbite I saw on TV) "We have to stop doing this"

Not doing the US any favours internationally I am sure and for me it just looks damned silly... and a little scary as if the US gets into problems... usually everyone else follows (c.f. sub prime scandal leads to global banking crisis)
 
Posted by dragonman97 (Member # 780) on October 05, 2013, 23:11:
 
Ser., you piqued my curiosity, so I consulted um...Wikipedia.
(As such, take /some/ of the following with a grain of salt.)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_public_debt
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Kingdom_national_debt

Looks like both of us have a sizable public debt.
Ours: "On April 2, 2013, debt held by the public was approximately $11.959 trillion or about 75% of GDP."
Yours: "As of Q1 2013 the national debt amounted to £1,377.4 billion, or 90.7% of total GDP."

To true those up, (1,377.4 billion) gbp in usd = $2.205 trillion (US dollars)
(via Wolfram|Alpha)
-or-
(11.959 trillion) usd in gbp = £7.47 trillion (British pounds)

IOW, both are big scary numbers. However, Paul Krugman has pointed out that (to paraphrase), national debts are nothing like your personal che[ck|que]book. (Zany as it sounds, it's apparently quite alright to run this sort of debt.) US Treasury notes are considered one of the safest investments in the world, backed by the full faith and credit of the US gov't, such that groups with big money choose them at a minor loss (i.e. 99.5% of face value) in lieu of out and out cash on occasion. The notion the Tea Party could put us at the risk of default over petty squabbling is revolting.

As such, the 'we have to stop doing this,' is largely about the constant tweaking of the limit - we should set it to automatically increase. Our debt goes back to the birth of the nation - if we were to try to spend so little as to keep within the limit, we'd probably have to slash Medicare and Social Security...which would go great with a certain key constituency.

I wish these shenanigans would have a real impact come election day, but naturally that's a year away for these clowns - I bet they wouldn't be pulling this stunt on an even year. :/
 
Posted by DoctorWho (Member # 392) on October 08, 2013, 22:52:
 
I fear dark times are looming for the U.S.
 
Posted by dragonman97 (Member # 780) on October 08, 2013, 23:51:
 
quote:
Originally posted by DoctorWho:
I fear dark times are looming for the U.S.

Um...right. That reminds me of some guy who posted around here in bold type, except this time it's red.

And now I see a new way to really tweak TP-morons - "Obama bonds". [Razz] Best of all, they're technically unconstitutional, but less so than letting the country default on its debts.

Man, these lazy clowns are pissing me off - just pass a clean bill already!
 
Posted by The Famous Druid (Member # 1769) on October 09, 2013, 00:49:
 
quote:
Originally posted by dragonman97:
Ours: "On April 2, 2013, debt held by the public was approximately $11.959 trillion or about 75% of GDP."
Yours: "As of Q1 2013 the national debt amounted to £1,377.4 billion, or 90.7% of total GDP."

For comparison: the aussie government's net debt is 11% of GDP.
The difference, both sides of politics here are mature enough to raise (about) the level of taxes needed to pay for their spending commitments.

Prediction: at the next US election, the Republicans will campaign on 2 things...
- The Debt Crisis
- Big Tax Cuts For EVERYONE!
 
Posted by DoctorWho (Member # 392) on October 09, 2013, 00:54:
 
Dman, normally I would be laughing at a page like that and calling it a bunch of nonsense. However, with what I have seen from people I know who have confirmed things about the government shutdown, how they have closed things that don't cost the government anything, and in some cases actually bring in an income yet they are closing them down anyhow. My cousin lives in South Dakota. He can't stop along the highway to view Mount Rushmore because they have traffic cones there to prevent you pulling over. I have an uncle in Florida who makes a living chartering fishing boats in the Florida Bay who can't because the Fed "closed the ocean". This is a power play to intentionally hurt the common man. I can only wonder what will happen next all things considered.
 
Posted by The Famous Druid (Member # 1769) on October 09, 2013, 06:36:
 
quote:
Originally posted by DoctorWho:
He can't stop along the highway to view Mount Rushmore because they have traffic cones there to prevent you pulling over.

The way I heard it, they closed the normal viewing areas in the park, so large numbers of visitors started just stopping on the highway, in places that were never meant for that, which is an obvious safety hazard.

Shutdown or not, the parks service are responsible for the safety of visitors, if the rangers all just go home and let visitors wander at will, and a passing truck ploughs through a crowd of camera-wielding tourists, who do you think the lawyers (and the GOP) will blame?
 
Posted by DoctorWho (Member # 392) on October 09, 2013, 09:31:
 
Yes, but here is the rub. He is friends with park rangers who told him that it is costing way more to keep visitors out than it would be to let them in and operate as normal. If the purpose of a government shutdown is to stop spending money then they are doing a piss poor job of it aren't they?
 
Posted by dragonman97 (Member # 780) on October 09, 2013, 11:06:
 
FWIW, as I understand it, the Park Rangers are an approved expense, the daily operations of the park are not. :/
 
Posted by TheMoMan (Member # 1659) on October 09, 2013, 12:02:
 
From the Jon Stewart website.
quote:
Stewart ended by calling out the GOP for the talking point that Obama negotiates with Iran but not them.

“You’re not helping yourself if it turns out that President Barack Obama can made a deal with the most intransigent, hardline, unreasonable, totalitarian mullahs in the world, but not with Republicans, maybe he’s not the problem!”


 
Posted by The Famous Druid (Member # 1769) on October 09, 2013, 19:10:
 
quote:
Originally posted by DoctorWho:
Yes, but here is the rub. He is friends with park rangers who told him that it is costing way more to keep visitors out than it would be to let them in and operate as normal. If the purpose of a government shutdown is to stop spending money then they are doing a piss poor job of it aren't they?

It's not about saving money, it's about not spending money they're legally not allowed to spend.
They're not allowed to spend money keeping the park open.
They are allowed to spend money securing closed facilities.
 
Posted by DoctorWho (Member # 392) on October 09, 2013, 21:46:
 
quote:
Originally posted by The Famous Druid:
quote:
Originally posted by DoctorWho:
Yes, but here is the rub. He is friends with park rangers who told him that it is costing way more to keep visitors out than it would be to let them in and operate as normal. If the purpose of a government shutdown is to stop spending money then they are doing a piss poor job of it aren't they?

It's not about saving money, it's about not spending money they're legally not allowed to spend.
They're not allowed to spend money keeping the park open.
They are allowed to spend money securing closed facilities.

...And no one else here thinks that is idiotic? Seriously, it's no wonder we are $17 trillion in debt! We need to put some common sense back into government!
 
Posted by TheMoMan (Member # 1659) on October 09, 2013, 22:09:
 
Politicians can we hunt them, and what is the bag limit?

Then how to dress them out and cooking instructions?
 
Posted by dragonman97 (Member # 780) on October 10, 2013, 00:27:
 
DoctorWho - of course it's idiotic, but so is shutting down the gov't over a law that legally passed in both chambers of Congress and was signed into law by the executive and reaffirmed by the judicial. Also, so is curtailing food stamps during an economic downturn!
 
Posted by DoctorWho (Member # 392) on October 10, 2013, 15:39:
 
What is more idiotic is that this is the first time a government shutdown is being purposely targeted to annoy and economically hurt the American citizens. They have never done this through any of the other shutdowns that have happened. It is as if our government is a two year old having a tantrum and it's disgraceful.
 
Posted by TheMoMan (Member # 1659) on October 10, 2013, 17:40:
 
SHUTDOWN IS SHUTDOWN
 
Posted by DoctorWho (Member # 392) on October 10, 2013, 21:54:
 
Yeah,

Just imagine how great it will be once we are all on government healthcare and then the government shuts down again. "What you want to visit your doctor? Sorry the government is shutdown for non-essentials."

Remember "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is a government big enough to take away everything that you have."
 
Posted by dragonman97 (Member # 780) on October 10, 2013, 22:40:
 
Um...not even close to true. Medicare is up and running right now, and so are the exchanges. Furthermore, once the plans set up through the latter are in place, they will be /privately/ administered. If you go to your doctor, Aetna is processing the bill, not Uncle Sam. The trick is that the exchanges exist as a bridge to an affordable marketplace for insurance that was previously out of reach to many.

The only reason I'm in the awful job I'm in is for health insurance - I could have walked if I thought I wouldn't go without it (and I don't have any medical conditions, but I'm aware of the fact that 'stuff happens' and insurance is important). (And some of my colleagues would have been tempted to do the same, but for some of them, it wasn't just themselves, but their families.)
 
Posted by DoctorWho (Member # 392) on October 10, 2013, 22:47:
 
Um it's not even close to affordable for many people. My insurance would go up more than 4 times what I pay if I were to be on it and I would not even get the coverage I have now and it's not even a premium plan.
 
Posted by The Famous Druid (Member # 1769) on October 11, 2013, 04:18:
 
quote:
Originally posted by DoctorWho:
quote:
It's not about saving money, it's about not spending money they're legally not allowed to spend.
They're not allowed to spend money keeping the park open.
They are allowed to spend money securing closed facilities.

...And no one else here thinks that is idiotic? Seriously, it's no wonder we are $17 trillion in debt! We need to put some common sense back into government!
What's idiotic is the politicians who forced the government shutdown thinking "shutdown" means "don't shutdown anything I like".


They're sending teachers home, they're sending helpers for the blind home, they're sending chemical plant safety inspectors home, they're letting food-stamp families go hungry, and then they whine like little bitches when the president doesn't break the law to keep a war memorial open?
Puh-lease!
 
Posted by DoctorWho (Member # 392) on October 11, 2013, 11:39:
 
quote:
Originally posted by The Famous Druid:
quote:
Originally posted by DoctorWho:
quote:
It's not about saving money, it's about not spending money they're legally not allowed to spend.
They're not allowed to spend money keeping the park open.
They are allowed to spend money securing closed facilities.

...And no one else here thinks that is idiotic? Seriously, it's no wonder we are $17 trillion in debt! We need to put some common sense back into government!
What's idiotic is the politicians who forced the government shutdown thinking "shutdown" means "don't shutdown anything I like".


They're sending teachers home, they're sending helpers for the blind home, they're sending chemical plant safety inspectors home, they're letting food-stamp families go hungry, and then they whine like little bitches when the president doesn't break the law to keep a war memorial open?
Puh-lease!

I agree that these are concerns, however the same principle applies with the war memorial as it does with Florida Bay and Mount Rushmore. If it costs the government more to close it than to leave it open, then it's idiotic to close it. Furthermore it's a slap in the face to all Americans when a bunch of people who are in this country illegally can have a rally within spitting distance of the memorial but Americans are barred from visiting an outdoor open air memorial that costs the government nothing to keep up.

Anyhow my uncle in Florida was going to move his boats because he has a friend who has a charter fishing business in Alabama. He was going to go there and get his overflow so he could keep afloat financially. But because the bay is closed he is not even allowed to have his boats leave the dock. He would have to pay for them to be put on trucks and be escorted over land to their destination which is extremely expensive comparatively speaking.

The whole thing is a mess. The affordable healthcare act is nothing but a cluster****. For the supreme court to say it was constitutional, they had to say that the fines associated with it were really taxes and now that it has passed they are calling them fines again. The president on his own has amended the law to exempt groups which is not only patently unfair but also unconstitutional for the president to do. The website which cost the government $634 million is not even good enough to be called a beta site. It's obvious that the whole debacle is disorganized and unprofessional.

And don't get me wrong. I do not just blame the democrats for this mess. Blame lies at the feet of 546 people.
435 house members
100 senators
9 supreme court justices
1 president
1 vice president

And blame lies at the feet of every one of them who preceded them that started us on this slippery slope.

Finally blame lies at the feet of the average American citizen who voted for these people. They are too busy looking at their smart phones and are more worried about what's happening with Hollywood than they are with the personal freedoms of the average citizen.

One more thing. For everyone who says "the affordable healthcare act is now the law of the land, stop trying to change it" I say, the rights guaranteed to American citizens by the Bill of Rights have been the law of the land for over 200 years. Stop trying to change them.
 
Posted by TheMoMan (Member # 1659) on October 11, 2013, 11:52:
 
Dr. Who, When you get angry enough, start changing things. Then you will find out how entrenched big business is in running this government. They have bought CONGRESS AND THE SUPREME COURT. On the state level gerrymandering has just about taken out the voting rights act.

Big Money Talks and the rest do not have enough to speak up. Try getting an appointment with your rep. but mister money bags can walk in unannounced.

Your and my wallets are not heavy enough.

If you try to use your 2nd Amendment rights and form your own militia watch how fast you show up on the NSA radar.
 
Posted by DoctorWho (Member # 392) on October 11, 2013, 21:09:
 
quote:
Originally posted by TheMoMan:
Dr. Who, When you get angry enough, start changing things. Then you will find out how entrenched big business is in running this government. They have bought CONGRESS AND THE SUPREME COURT. On the state level gerrymandering has just about taken out the voting rights act.

Big Money Talks and the rest do not have enough to speak up. Try getting an appointment with your rep. but mister money bags can walk in unannounced.


Your and my wallets are not heavy enough.

If you try to use your 2nd Amendment rights and form your own militia watch how fast you show up on the NSA radar.

I must say that I agree with everything you just said.

Here is a bit of Jay Leno for your amusement. Too bad NBC doesn't have the guts to keep him on the air. Maybe another network that has a backbone will pick him up.
 
Posted by TheMoMan (Member # 1659) on October 11, 2013, 21:39:
 
I have watched this Country being sold to the highest bidder.
 
Posted by The Famous Druid (Member # 1769) on October 11, 2013, 21:59:
 
quote:
Originally posted by DoctorWho:
If it costs the government more to close it than to leave it open, then it's idiotic to close it.

Your basic mistake is thinking this is aimed at saving money. Nothing could be further from the truth.

This shutdown won't 'save' taxpayers money, it will cost taxpayers a fortune.

All of the currently furloughed workers will get back-paid once this mess is resolved, not one penny of salary is being 'saved' by the shutdown. But there are costs, security for shutdown facilities, loss of revenue from closed national parks, etc.

Idiotic or not, in the current situation, there are some things the government is allowed to spend money on, and others they're not.

Obama isn't allowed to take $1 of approved spending and shift it over to a 'better' unapproved use. That's the law.
 
Posted by DoctorWho (Member # 392) on October 11, 2013, 22:25:
 
quote:
Originally posted by The Famous Druid:
quote:
Originally posted by DoctorWho:
If it costs the government more to close it than to leave it open, then it's idiotic to close it.

Your basic mistake is thinking this is aimed at saving money. Nothing could be further from the truth.

This shutdown won't 'save' taxpayers money, it will cost taxpayers a fortune.

All of the currently furloughed workers will get back-paid once this mess is resolved, not one penny of salary is being 'saved' by the shutdown. But there are costs, security for shutdown facilities, loss of revenue from closed national parks, etc.

Idiotic or not, in the current situation, there are some things the government is allowed to spend money on, and others they're not.

Obama isn't allowed to take $1 of approved spending and shift it over to a 'better' unapproved use. That's the law.

Don't make me laugh that hard or I'll need an oxygen tank. Both sides of the isle do "unapproved" things in direct violation of law all the time. Obama included. I just gave an example in a previous post about how he violated the constitution by taking it upon himself to amend the affordable healthcare act. Amending any law is only supposed to be done by the Congress and then signed by the President. He is picking and choosing what he wants to enforce and what he wants to ignore. I lived with being bullied on an almost constant basis from age 5 till I was 16. I know vindictiveness when I see it!
 
Posted by Ashitaka (Member # 4924) on October 14, 2013, 16:21:
 
quote:
Originally posted by The Famous Druid:
quote:
Originally posted by DoctorWho:
If it costs the government more to close it than to leave it open, then it's idiotic to close it.

Your basic mistake is thinking this is aimed at saving money. Nothing could be further from the truth.


exactly, the point of the shutdown is to obey the law, and the law is goverment run facilities are closed unless it is nessasary.
 
Posted by dragonman97 (Member # 780) on October 14, 2013, 21:09:
 
Speaking of which, for all the bellyaching, it's now the case that NY state and a few other states will pay to run key parks such as the Statue of Liberty and Mount Rushmore.

And it's easy to carp about a park, but a /lot/ of useful and important services have been stopped and aren't as visible, causing a lot of folks to prattle on about 'the shutdown isn't so bad.' So can you imagine why there might be some appeal in letting parts of the shutdown be seen, to keep pressure on Congress-critters to frigging...do their job?
 
Posted by TheMoMan (Member # 1659) on October 14, 2013, 21:18:
 
You really want to mess with congress have them shut down EFTs and/or ATMs
 
Posted by dragonman97 (Member # 780) on October 15, 2013, 00:28:
 
quote:
Originally posted by TheMoMan:
You really want to mess with congress have them shut down EFTs and/or ATMs

Um...ATMs are operated by the private sector. I'm pretty sure the FDIC is self funded by member fees, and probably so is the ACH.

Shutting down Social Security, OTOH...that would get things on track so fast, the vote counting circuitry would catch fire...
 
Posted by DoctorWho (Member # 392) on October 15, 2013, 00:41:
 
quote:
Originally posted by Ashitaka:
quote:
Originally posted by The Famous Druid:
quote:
Originally posted by DoctorWho:
If it costs the government more to close it than to leave it open, then it's idiotic to close it.

Your basic mistake is thinking this is aimed at saving money. Nothing could be further from the truth.


exactly, the point of the shutdown is to obey the law, and the law is goverment run facilities are closed unless it is nessasary.
And as I said, politicians pick and choose which laws they want to enforce.
Clinton kept them open. If we wanted to prevent government shutdowns, we would need a law that says the members of Congress and the President and Vice President do not get a paycheck or back pay during a government shutdown. Want to get them to promote a healthy economy, make their income inversely proportionate to the percentage of people on welfare. Also make all deals where they get money other than their salary while they hold public office illegal. No moonlighting while you work for the citizens, it's a conflict of interest. Penalties could include fines, imprisonment and loss of government pension depending upon the severity of the crime.
 
Posted by TheMoMan (Member # 1659) on October 17, 2013, 08:05:
 
Two+ weeks of speachs and for what, All this BS small businesses bankrupt, for what. this was like an internal "civil war". Government against the people. We sure have the government we deserve.

WTF and show me in the codes of the USA this D#(& Hastert Rule.
 
Posted by DoctorWho (Member # 392) on October 17, 2013, 10:59:
 
Saw this last night. For those who might think I am biased one way or the other, I just want you to note that I see the BS on both sides of the fence and the odor is equally repugnant.
 
Posted by TheMoMan (Member # 1659) on October 17, 2013, 11:09:
 
This is blatant "CYA"


Vote them all out.
 
Posted by DoctorWho (Member # 392) on October 17, 2013, 11:34:
 
I wish voting them all out would solve the problem. Unfortunately, it doesn't take very long for the newly elected ones to become just as corrupt as the ones who have been in there.
 
Posted by dragonman97 (Member # 780) on October 17, 2013, 22:04:
 
Just in case anyone thought that video was a tad perplexing(*), I found this synopsis on Wikipedia:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chris_Van_Hollen#Role_in_the_U.S._government_shutdown_of_2013

(For anyone else similarly surprised - Chaffetz was the Speaker Pro Tempore.)

(*) The agita involved gave me flashbacks to recent dealings with my utterly awful VP.
 
Posted by TheMoMan (Member # 1659) on October 18, 2013, 14:49:
 
Dman & Dr. Who, after watching that video clip. I came to the conclusion that 54K of my peers died in vain. Secondly that P($$ $)^ standing in as the chair would have wet his pants the first time a round zinged by his pointy little head.

This is not why I was in the service!
 
Posted by TheMoMan (Member # 1659) on October 25, 2013, 10:32:
 
Does any one remember the discussions about the "Patriot Act". How do we get that genie back into the flask?

I always knew that the cellular providers knew where we were for the hand shaking between the phones and towers (switches).

I was also aware that the Internet was developed with Govt. moneys to tie researchers on projects together.

By law they are supposed to get a warrant to tap your land line however if you use a cordless phone they can listen in to the radio in the phone.

So are the ardino, Lego, and stamps, chips NSA backdoored? Second question how many would it take to build a CPU that NSA could not enter?
 


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