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Author Topic: introduction
Eric-Ofcourse
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Icon 1 posted November 01, 2007 11:01      Profile for Eric-Ofcourse     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Hi everyone.

My name is Eric, I study neurophysiology at the University of Cologne in Germany.

My interests outside of biology are economics, and health, i.e. eating healthy, counting calories and doing stuff like that, working out. I would like to see what intelligent people are like in the wild, thats what I'm here for.

Theres not much else to say about me really.

*breaks a wine bottle over the computer

Well thats my maiden post.
Eric

Posts: 12 | Registered: Oct 2007  |  IP: Logged
Ashitaka

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Icon 1 posted November 01, 2007 11:31      Profile for Ashitaka     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Willkommen

Is that your kitchen you took your picture in or do you keep your food in a medicine cabinet, because that is what it looks like. Ifthat is your kitchen, how big is it, because I think my bathroom is bigger.

[Wink]

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"If they're not gonna make a distinction between Muslims and violent extremists, then why should I take the time to distinguish between decent, fearful white people and racists?"

-Assif Mandvi

Posts: 3089 | From: Switzerland | Registered: Feb 2006  |  IP: Logged
Eric-Ofcourse
Maximum Newbie
Member # 12035

Icon 10 posted November 01, 2007 11:37      Profile for Eric-Ofcourse     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Hi,

Yes, thats my kitchen. [Cool]

Its smaller than your bathroom in all likelihood.

Posts: 12 | Registered: Oct 2007  |  IP: Logged
BooBooKitty

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Icon 1 posted November 01, 2007 13:36      Profile for BooBooKitty     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Welcome, Eric. Sit back and enjoy. [Smile]
Posts: 796 | From: Montreal, Canada | Registered: Aug 2006  |  IP: Logged
stevenback7
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Icon 1 posted November 01, 2007 15:58      Profile for stevenback7   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Welcome - hope you enjoy the forums.

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Comic Book Guy: There is no emoticon for what i'm feeling.

Posts: 1199 | From: Canada eh? | Registered: May 2006  |  IP: Logged
Richard Wolf VI
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Member # 4993

Icon 10 posted November 01, 2007 17:05      Profile for Richard Wolf VI   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Hey! Welcome to the forums!

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The same old iWanToUseaMac... Who am I fooling? I'm getting a Wii now, iWanToUseaMac isn't :P
Get Opera. The best web experience.
Contest. Group. Success.

Posts: 1356 | From: Bogotá, Colombia | Registered: Mar 2006  |  IP: Logged
Stereo

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Icon 1 posted November 01, 2007 18:28      Profile for Stereo     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Ohhhh! Neurophysiology! [hearts] I've been interested in artificial intelligence, more specifically to neural nets for a good 10 years now. My real work is nowhere near that, though, so to have someone who kinda look at this stuff around will probably be the closest I'll ever get to the real thing. Well, unless I someday get rich enough so I can go back to school full-time without sacrifying my little comfort.

Ah, so welcome, make yourself comfortable. Kitchen is in the back, I've brought a few variety of green tea, so help yourself if you like it. There might be some donuts or brownies in the fridge, but better ask before taking any - some can be very protective of their stuff.

See you around!

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Eppur, si muove!

Galileo Galilei

Posts: 2289 | From: Gatineau, Quebec, Canada | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
hal9000
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Icon 1 posted November 01, 2007 20:34      Profile for hal9000   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Welcome, and enjoy!! I am the dumbest of the bunch... [crazy] with a really bad sense of humor. [Big Grin]

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P.E.B.K.A.C. if you can fix this, you can fix anything.

Posts: 183 | From: VA under a bridge living in a van. | Registered: Jul 2007  |  IP: Logged
Eric-Ofcourse
Maximum Newbie
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Icon 1 posted November 02, 2007 10:49      Profile for Eric-Ofcourse     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Hi and thanks to everyone for the welcome. [Cool]

Stereo, if your reading this..

What sort of neural nets are you interested in? I'm acquainted with very little outside of my working area, which has to do with tracing the network controlling leg movement in the stick insect. We basically identify individual neuron populations and their connections and then test hypotheses about their functioning together.

Its really cool to see a bunch of connected dots with inhibitory or excitatory connections and then realize that all that actually performs a real-life function, so elucidating the way the network works is a part of the conceptual 'thrill' for me in this work.

Anyway, my advisors and workload make it difficult to break out of my area of expertise so any stuff you might be interested in would be interesting for me at least to hear about.

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Xanthine

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Icon 7 posted November 02, 2007 11:03      Profile for Xanthine     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Neurophysiology...that's like metazoans and shit right? I stay away from those things. Bacteria are messy enough. Once you add internal membranes and multiple cells the complications just go over the top.

Anyways, welcome to the forums. Nice to see another labrat/benchmonkey around here!

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And it's one, two, three / On the wrong side of the lee / What were you meant for? / What were you meant for?
- The Decemberists

Posts: 7670 | From: the lab | Registered: Mar 2001  |  IP: Logged
Stereo

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Icon 1 posted November 02, 2007 11:50      Profile for Stereo     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Eric-Ofcourse:
Stereo, if your reading this..

What sort of neural nets are you interested in?

Well, I did a little research/term paper on neuro-fuzzy networks for my advanced undergraduate artificial intelligence course. But it's the learning abilities of neural networks that is the most interesting to me. I believe this to allow a real level of intelligence in machine, as it can adapt to knowlege too complex for a complete definition as is required in regular programming.

Think language, for example: although the human brain can easily understand local variations and slang, just programming all of a language's vocabulary, grammar, exceptions and contextual variations is close to impossible. So I think that building an artificial network - it would be big, I know - to handle the language is the best way to achieve true speech recognition. Then there's artificial vision, or at a completely different level, prediction of the effects of a new drug on the human body, or even a personnal assistant that could adapt to one's personnality and know what is "normal" behaviour, and when to call the police/ambulance (don't if the cries come from really great sex, do if it's spouse beating)... [crazy] [Big Grin]

But although I understand most of the underlying concepts (inputs, activation function, activation threshold, propagation), and I can guess out what the neural net should look like for trivial problems, I get lost at designing a more complex network, and I wouldn't know where to begin to build one. (I think OOP would be the most appropriate software approach, but how to represent the structure? Should I allow for self-pruning, or only program a network fully designed, at the risk of having to go back if the design is lacking? And what kind of learning process should I choose?)

Alas, my knowlege is strictly theoric, and quite superficial. I can see the possibilities, but not the path that leads there. So hearing about the real stuff might help me get a better understanding of the big picture, and how all the parts fit together. This would then allow me to go to the next complexity level. I hope.

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Eppur, si muove!

Galileo Galilei

Posts: 2289 | From: Gatineau, Quebec, Canada | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
Eric-Ofcourse
Maximum Newbie
Member # 12035

Icon 1 posted November 02, 2007 13:03      Profile for Eric-Ofcourse     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Stereo:

But although I understand most of the underlying concepts (inputs, activation function, activation threshold, propagation), and I can guess out what the neural net should look like for trivial problems, I get lost at designing a more complex network, and I wouldn't know where to begin to build one. (I think OOP would be the most appropriate software approach, but how to represent the structure? Should I allow for self-pruning, or only program a network fully designed, at the risk of having to go back if the design is lacking? And what kind of learning process should I choose?)

Alas, my knowlege is strictly theoric, and quite superficial. I can see the possibilities, but not the path that leads there. So hearing about the real stuff might help me get a better understanding of the big picture, and how all the parts fit together. This would then allow me to go to the next complexity level. I hope.

Hi Stereo, thanks for your reply.

Are you actively engaged in some kind of programming, or a concrete project relating to Neuro-fuzzy-AI, or are you more interested in understanding these things theoretically?

What are Neuro-fuzzy networks programmed "on" in real life? Are they computer modelled or do they have their own hardware?

I've been Wikipedia researching this for about a half an hour since your first post and among other things I came across http://www.20q.net.

Its an AI program that has been learning for years. I took the Simpsons quiz and it read my mind twice. Chilling.

Thanks for bringing this area to my attention. [Wink]

Posts: 12 | Registered: Oct 2007  |  IP: Logged
Stereo

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Icon 1 posted November 03, 2007 06:07      Profile for Stereo     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
As I said, my actual line of work is nowhere near that kind of programming (the most complex things I do is asp pages! [blush] ), and my schedule is getting quite full from non-programming activities (gym every other day, ballroom dancing once a week, and I still keep some time for graphic novels and mangas). So no, I don't have any specific project about that for now, so I keep it theoretical, yet I hope that I'll some day be able to use that knowlege for something practical.

Artificial neural nets can be both hardware and software, although I think software to be prevalent (and that would be my personnal choice as my hardware-building skill is minimal).

But if you'd like to explore this field a bit more, I could dig out some reference for textbook on neural nets for bioinformatics, that is artificial nets that reproduce animal (usually insect-like) behaviour or skills. (I seem to remember an example of a six-legged machine using an artificial neural net to walk.)

Think of it as the other side of the coin you are working on!

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Eppur, si muove!

Galileo Galilei

Posts: 2289 | From: Gatineau, Quebec, Canada | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
Eric-Ofcourse
Maximum Newbie
Member # 12035

Icon 1 posted November 03, 2007 08:19      Profile for Eric-Ofcourse     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Stereo:

Artificial neural nets can be both hardware and software, although I think software to be prevalent (and that would be my personnal choice as my hardware-building skill is minimal).

But if you'd like to explore this field a bit more, I could dig out some reference for textbook on neural nets for bioinformatics, that is artificial nets that reproduce animal (usually insect-like) behaviour or skills. (I seem to remember an example of a six-legged machine using an artificial neural net to walk.)

Hi Stereo, thanks again for the reply.

I guess if you know of any good internet sites where there are explanations for beginners, that might be better than a textbook right now. I'm going to use Wikipedia first off to explore things further. What would you like to do with neural nets– or is it more like "the journey is more important than the destination" type of thing?

The six-legged walking machines you mentioned, at least a few versions of them were designed by people I know! There are lots of different versions though. The guy I sit across from at my desk is going to premier a new one in February if all goes well.

any further help much appreciated!

Posts: 12 | Registered: Oct 2007  |  IP: Logged
Ashitaka

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Icon 1 posted November 04, 2007 02:50      Profile for Ashitaka     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
That 20 questios game is interesting but it is startign to frustraet me. I keep playing the movies version as that is what I am nost familiar with. THe program can rarely guess the charachter I am thinking of and the program is full of wrong information. I think many dedicated people are trying to make this progam dumb, or the people playing the game are don't know the facts. At the end of the game I input the answer that was not guessed and the program lists the condradictions to its knowledge that I have imput. I check the contradictions agaist IMDB and I am always right. The computer cannot guess my charachters becuase almost every one I think of (except for the reall really well known ones i.e. han solo) have worng informationinthe programs database.

On one hand I am frustrated and do not want to play anymore, but on the other hand I want to teach this thing the correct answers.

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"If they're not gonna make a distinction between Muslims and violent extremists, then why should I take the time to distinguish between decent, fearful white people and racists?"

-Assif Mandvi

Posts: 3089 | From: Switzerland | Registered: Feb 2006  |  IP: Logged
Eric-Ofcourse
Maximum Newbie
Member # 12035

Icon 1 posted November 04, 2007 09:50      Profile for Eric-Ofcourse     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Ashitaka:

On one hand I am frustrated and do not want to play anymore, but on the other hand I want to teach this thing the correct answers.

lol. You're doing it for the good of the machine? [Smile]
Posts: 12 | Registered: Oct 2007  |  IP: Logged


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