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Author Topic: Apple :-(
Snaggy

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Icon 3 posted June 26, 2010 08:47      Profile for Snaggy   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
on my 3GS, running the new iOS, the same thing happens with the bars dropping off when you hold the phone a certain way. I haven't checked if it actually affects a cellular phone call, but I can't get it to drop down to "no service".

On Nitrozac's 3GS, running the previous software, this also happens to a lesser degree, and it requires more effort and death grip intensity.

Shroom, can you repeat the call-dropping-just-by-holding-it thing?

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CommanderShroom
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Icon 1 posted June 26, 2010 10:37      Profile for CommanderShroom     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Hey Snaggy.

I can definitely repeat the dropped bar thing. While I did notice a drop in reception on the 3G, it never went to zero unlike the 4. The issue iw that I tend to cup the bottom of the phone when I hold. Then add to it that I am a lefty and it is a no-go.

However, I did buy a case for the phone last night. Mostly from the fear of a drop and also because of the dropped bar thing. With the case I can't repeat it. But as an FYI, I bought one of the silicone sleeve style ones. Mostly because it felt like it would offer better shock resistance than a hard case. Plus it felt more secure in my hand, like it would be less prone to slipping next to a smooth plastic one.

And while I do have the newest of the new iPhone, I am not in for the status of having an iPhone, so covering it up to make it nondescript doesn't bother me one bit.

--------------------
Does he know our big secret?
Has one of us confessed?
'Bout the wires circuits and motors
Buried in our chest

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Snaggy

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Icon 3 posted June 26, 2010 10:50      Profile for Snaggy   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Shroom: Dropped bars, or actual no reception and the call is dropped? I keep reading conflicting reports as to whether the dropped reception is real or just a software display thing with the bars. (tnx in advance)

http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/10/06/25/death_grip_hysteria_may_end_monday_with_ios_4_01.html

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CommanderShroom
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Icon 1 posted June 26, 2010 11:05      Profile for CommanderShroom     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Both unfortunately. It takes about a minute to drop a call completely for me.

And get this...

I had the chance to buy the old 3G from my work for T. So before we did it, I call AT&T to make sure our current data plan would be sufficient(we have unlimited data for both of our phones). I was assured that we were perfectly fine. Now mind you I told them what phone, and what package we had, and they checked my account to confirm it.

Guess that confirmation was only a one day offer or something. They told me this morning that now I have to get the special iPhone plan... A$$h**e$...

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macmcseboy

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Icon 1 posted June 26, 2010 12:24      Profile for macmcseboy     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
As an Out of warranty fix it joint for iPhone 3G and iPhone 3GS. The antenna is in the bottom of the phone glued to the Speaker/mic/dock port assy. Never have had an issue with dropped calls or signals save for remote areas.

I have dissected an original iPhone (2G) There is an antenna line that goes from the phone board to the antenna assy in the bottom of the phone (black plastic area on bottom rear)

The only place I have real difficult with a dropped call or signal reception drop is my Apartment Elevator.... The thing is shrouded in Stainless steel, so it acts like a Faraday Cage.

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GrumpySteen

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Icon 1 posted June 26, 2010 12:33      Profile for GrumpySteen     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
All jokes aside, the issue is just that the stainless steel frame is used as the antenna. That means that you can physically touch the antenna and, when you do, you become part of the antenna.

Unfortunately, the human body isn't a very good antenna and a finely tuned antenna is no longer finely tuned when you extend it with a large chunk of meat. Think about what happens if you grab the antenna on a portable radio with your hand... reception usually either improves or dissappears. Same thing with the iPhone, except it's extremely unlikely that you being part of the antenna will improve reception.

There may be some issues with the software, but the software doesn't detect that your hand is on the bottom of the phone and start reducing signal reception.

What Apple should do is distribute cheap cases to the people who bought an iPhone 4. Cheap silicone cases would cost a few cents each, so it's not like it would make a huge difference in their profit margin. The case would prevent contact with the antenna and, as a bonus, would reduce breakage from edge-on impacts on the glass. People would still buy the nicer looking, more expensive cases and the issue would be resolved with a minimum of fuss.

But that probably won't happen unless customers get really pissed off and start screaming instead of making polite comments and silly jokes.

P.S. Hitler is upset about it too

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dragonman97

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Icon 1 posted June 26, 2010 13:36      Profile for dragonman97   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Awesome video, Steen!

And speaking of a 'plastic case' - why not just give out a 'bumper' case to each iPhone 4 owner who asks for one? At least until they fix it, that only seems fair.

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MacManKrisK

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Icon 1 posted June 26, 2010 14:54      Profile for MacManKrisK     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by GrumpySteen:
Cheap silicone cases would cost a few cents each, so it's not like it would make a huge difference in their profit margin.

Or, being Apple, they would justify charging $100 more for the phone because of the "insanely great," anti-slip, designer silicone case that comes with it!

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get rich and you still die"


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Venture
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Icon 1 posted June 28, 2010 11:44      Profile for Venture   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Just thought I'd toss this out there :-D

HTC antenna design

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The Famous Druid

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Icon 1 posted June 30, 2010 03:19      Profile for The Famous Druid     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
This is how to hold an iPhone (NSFW - if you work at the American Family Association)

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If you watch 'The History Of NASA' backwards, it's about a space agency that has no manned spaceflight capability, then does low-orbit flights, then lands on the Moon.

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Ashitaka

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Icon 1 posted June 30, 2010 04:26      Profile for Ashitaka     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by The Famous Druid:
This is how to hold an iPhone (NSFW - if you work at the American Family Association)

I would by the new iPhone if meant I could get my hands on an iPhone holder like that.

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GrumpySteen

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Icon 1 posted June 30, 2010 08:48      Profile for GrumpySteen     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Heh... Apple has three job openings for "Antenna Engineer - iPad/iPhone"

Job 1
Job 2
Job 3

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CommanderShroom
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Icon 1 posted June 30, 2010 08:58      Profile for CommanderShroom     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
So I have had a few days with the iPhone 4 and dealt with the antenna issue.

Here is what I have noticed.

The 3G is a better phone than the 4. Hands down. I now drop at least one out of three calls on the 4. The 3G dropped perhaps one out of a couple dozen.

Even with the silly-cone sleeve I have on it, the reception is spotty at best. I don't get the drop in bars that I got before hand, but the ability for the phone to hang on to a call is really quite terrible.

It may be that I am in a bad area, but since my household is an AT&T household, I don't think that this holds much water.

The 3G got(and still gets) better connections and a more reliable call quality. I have a Pantech phone that *never* drops calls here. We just retired a Sony phone that never had that issue either. Same for a Blackberry, and an older Motorola.

So phone for phone, the iPhone 4 sucks.

The pluses, since it wouldn't be fair to add a gripe without some kudos.

The smart features work very well. WiFi seems to be better than the 3G. The screen is gorgeous. It isn't the resolution so much as the vivid colors. And it does seem to be much faster than the 3G WRT programs and such.

The new body however doesn't feel as nice in the hand. The edges are not quite as comfortable. And of course the glass body is just downright scary. We have already had a broken phone here at my work. One of the sales team dropped it out of his pocket while mowing his lawn. It appears the phone must have hit a piece of gravel or rock and broke the screen.

So that means that this phone is extremely delicate. That is something that doesn't sit well with me. Especially since I have literally sent the 3G skidding across my patio while working with it in my pocket. And dropped it from standing positions without hardly any damage( I once had to pop the case to fix the silent button). But this phone I doubt will ever be able to take that abuse.

So my final verdict?

Gorgeous looking hardware and screen.

Fantastic program and smart phone abilities.

Abysmal actual phone abilities.

And downright frightening when it comes to taking any day to day knocks.

The absolute truth is if it was my own money, I wouldn't own one.

--------------------
Does he know our big secret?
Has one of us confessed?
'Bout the wires circuits and motors
Buried in our chest

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Snaggy

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Icon 9 posted June 30, 2010 09:22      Profile for Snaggy   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Thanks Shroom!

whoa, that sucks, my geek sympathies. I love my iPhone 3GS's reception, and would hate for that to change if I upgraded. And I have dropped it on concrete floors a couple time, with no issues. So now I'm thinking of sitting out this generation, despite my lust for the Retina screen.

I guess I need to hold one first and see if I'm one of those accursed.

Be interesting to see how Apple responds in the next month, or if they do not.

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CommanderShroom
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Icon 1 posted June 30, 2010 09:47      Profile for CommanderShroom     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Snaggy, you of course might want to take some of my thoughts with a grain of salt. I have yet to be truly converted to the iPhone. Truth is, I bought a Pantech instead of the iPhone for my own personal use. I don't care for touch screen phones at all. And while a great touch screen, I never have grown to enjoy it.

I do think that feature-wise the 4 is a leap ahead of the 3G. But I hope there will be some major fixes made to the iPhone 4 that make it better for day to day use.

quote:
Originally posted by Snaggy:
Thanks Shroom!

whoa, that sucks, my geek sympathies. I love my iPhone 3GS's reception, and would hate for that to change if I upgraded. And I have dropped it on concrete floors a couple time, with no issues. So now I'm thinking of sitting out this generation, despite my lust for the Retina screen.

I guess I need to hold one first and see if I'm one of those accursed.

Be interesting to see how Apple responds in the next month, or if they do not.



--------------------
Does he know our big secret?
Has one of us confessed?
'Bout the wires circuits and motors
Buried in our chest

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GrumpySteen

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Icon 1 posted June 30, 2010 11:02      Profile for GrumpySteen     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
*snicker*

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dragonman97

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Icon 1 posted June 30, 2010 15:58      Profile for dragonman97   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by GrumpySteen:
*snicker*

[Big Grin] [Big Grin]

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Callipygous
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Icon 1 posted June 30, 2010 17:52      Profile for Callipygous     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
This article has what seems to me, a thorough investigation of the antenna issue. I wonder if Shroom's dropped calls problem might be caused by issues with the proximity sensor or it's calibration, rather than the antenna. If so that could be fixed by a software update.

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The Famous Druid

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Icon 1 posted June 30, 2010 19:53      Profile for The Famous Druid     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by GrumpySteen:
Heh... Apple has three job openings for "Antenna Engineer - iPad/iPhone"

Job 1
Job 2
Job 3

Interesting, the antenna system was designed by people with masters or doctorates in Engineering, and yet every blogger in the world could have done a better job.

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Xanthine

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Icon 1 posted June 30, 2010 22:40      Profile for Xanthine     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Oh now that is just too funny on too many levels. Especially since I know people who could probably get hired for that job, but won't even apply because they've got their own gigs.

To be fair to the Apple engineers, what an engineer recommends and what a company ultimately does can be wildly divergent.

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dragonman97

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Icon 1 posted July 01, 2010 06:42      Profile for dragonman97   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Xanthine:
To be fair to the Apple engineers, what an engineer recommends and what a company ultimately does can be wildly divergent.

And /. folks rightly pointed out, Apple's Super-Secrecy Mode may have prevented people from actually know what the /real/ implementation was, save for the marketing folks, who have no idea how antennas work. Obviously the antennas worked in FCC testing, as they weren't tested with humans in the lab. Additionally, the 'field tests' were seemingly done with 'cloaked' units, which perfectly insulated the holder/user from the unit, preventing the widespread problems of late. If Apple had an ounce of common sense, it would have risked some visual exposure to allow for proper testing -- and maybe they could have changed the paint job and made the OS appear 'uglier' to give the appearance that it was 'just another phone.' [If you got rid of the 'swipe to unlock' and made a list of choices instead of pretty icons, it would probably fail the visual sniff test.]

P.S. http://lifehacker.com/5575999/use-a-cheap-bracelet-to-fix-your-iphone-4-signal-woes

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CommanderShroom
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Icon 1 posted July 01, 2010 07:43      Profile for CommanderShroom     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Calli,

I am wondering if some of the dropped calls is from the proximity sensor myself. Which is sort of a good thing. If it can be fixed by simply performing a software update on the phone, that would be great. The fact that it has not been a "life changing" experience(and truthfully not even a particularly good experience) does not enamor me with the iPhone anyway.

Of course my company has been on the Cupertino bandwagon as of late so we are happily beta testing the iPhone4. Or at least management, dev, and sales are happily beta testing. Lowly tech support/software QA guy (me) is not quite so overjoyed with the idea.

quote:
Originally posted by Callipygous:
I wonder if Shroom's dropped calls problem might be caused by issues with the proximity sensor or it's calibration, rather than the antenna. If so that could be fixed by a software update.


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fs

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Icon 1 posted July 01, 2010 08:01      Profile for fs   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
If I bought a phone and it worked poorly or not at all because I held it in my hand, you know I'd be returning that piece of junk soooo fast.

How does that even make it out of testing? Seriously, they never tried using their product like a normal person?

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Venture
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Icon 1 posted July 01, 2010 15:30      Profile for Venture   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I don't mean to beat a dead horse but...
Ha! This made me laugh

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GrumpySteen

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Icon 1 posted July 01, 2010 15:47      Profile for GrumpySteen     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Hah... just as funny as when I posted it five days ago [Smile]

As long as I'm posting, there have been more tests done that show that the exposed antenna is a problem... quite possibly the only problem. There's a particularly good writeup on Gizmodo.

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