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Author Topic: More about Saddam
never_ask_why333
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Icon 1 posted January 03, 2007 15:47      Profile for never_ask_why333     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
When I had found out of Saddam's death, I had decided to write a speech about it. So when I had some slow-time at work, as I like to call it, I sat down and wrote about it.

Unfortunately, it is still at my work place. Typical.

Anyway, I still remembered some of my major points, and I would like to share :


As most of us already know, Saddam Hussein was executed a few days ago. Personally, I feel that all the events surrounding his capture and henceforth that have been done were unjust, unfair, and out of anger/fear/hate. Not to mention that it was done in haste.

Saddam was a ruler to some. To others he was a tyrant. I'm not saying I am any sort of supporter -in any way,shape or form. But we was not the first of the 'tyrants' that we have had to encounter, and he probably will not be the last. More so, I do not think that he is really as 'evil' as most of us believe him to be.

Lets look at Hitler, for example. Like Saddam, I do not think that he in as 'bad' as so many of us portray him. His mission in life --and the cause of all the horrible things in his life-- actually started out as good intentions, that merely got lead astray. Unlike so many people today (yes, including many of our 'rulers'/authorities) his initial motivations were not to better himself, gain power, etc. He wanted to help the world, to make it a better place, to get rid of what he believed was polluting it...namely, the Jews. And true, he did get carried away, as the power of it all contorted his intial mission (ie the concentration camps, etc). But if you really stop and think about it, is that not *exactly* what we just did to Saddam? We took it upon ourselves to judge what is 'right' and what is 'wrong'. But really, who are we to do that? Who are we, sinners, we all are (don't worry I'm not going into a religious thing). Who are we to decide who deserved life? Who are we to kill our own kind? But, to build on a point I only briefly touched-- we just did to Hussein what he did to others, and what Hitler did. We are hypocrits. Hitler believed that the Jews were unworthy. He feared them to an extent, and he hated them. He thought that they were polluting our earth, and were not contributing to the world the way he felt they should of. This is the way most of us felt about Hussein. We feared him, we hated him. We thought he was a danger to us, that he no longer belonged here. So, just like Hitler did to the Jews, we took it upon ourselves to decide.... and now one of our own is dead. We did EXACTLY what Hitler did, and we did exaclty what Saddam did.
And if we were to claim not to be hypocrits about this, that we did what is 'right', then by that law in which we have created, then the majority of us should really have deserved to have been right next to Saddam, with a noose waiting for us. Because in convicting him, and having him murdered, we committed exactly the same crime in which he was punished.
One of the biggest points -beyond those which I hope you have already gotten from this- that I hope you get is this : humanity as a whole is taking its power too far, and it is getting dangerous. It is at war within itself, and most people are so blinded that they do not even realize what side they are truly on, much less what they are fighting for. We as humans make mistakes, and while we may be alotted some room for justice, using the death penalty is taking it just too far. Who are we really, to decide what is right and what is wrong? Sure, it might be what we have been taught since infancy, but do we really know? I don't think so, otherwise we would not be taking the very life of our own bretheren! We have too much power, and it is only harming humanity. I just hope everyone can wake up and see that, before it is too late for us all.

:: anyway ::

those were just some of my thoughts/opinions on the matter. Just wanted to know what ya'll thought. As in, what your opinions are, and why.

Also, I'm going to try and re-write the speech ( I work at a fruit stand and we closed up for the next three months, so the probablility of me finding that speech isn't very good. Also it was just my first draft, so it wasn't well put together yet). Any tips on how I could better...manifest... my ideas would be appreciated. Or any tips at all.

Thanks [Smile]

*puts on armor and dawns a shield*

--------------------
I haven't forgotten
and I won't forget
I just haven't gotten
around to it yet

You can call me Eternity :)

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TheMoMan
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Icon 1 posted January 03, 2007 16:32      Profile for TheMoMan         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
never_ask_why333_________________The bloody wars you speak of are often fought over how and where your opponent kneels to pray. I have been to war I have dead bretren, and it is all senseless. CP and my self often get many people here riled up over our opinions about war and its aftermath.

Now on the good side how many of you have heard about The Subway Hero? There is in my humble opinion a true hero. That man needs a wheelbarrow to haul his gonads around.

--------------------
Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.


Benjamin Franklin,

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Callipygous
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Icon 1 posted January 03, 2007 16:53      Profile for Callipygous     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
If you are seriously trying to write a piece that tries to justify Hitler and Saddam Hussein, you'll need more than help with grammar.

But I assume this is actually either a joke or simply flame bait, and I'm not biting.

--------------------
"Knowledge is Power. France is Bacon" - Milton

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GMx

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Icon 1 posted January 03, 2007 17:30      Profile for GMx     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
What we need is less about Saddam. [Roll Eyes]
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never_ask_why333
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Icon 1 posted January 04, 2007 08:01      Profile for never_ask_why333     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I'm just going to do this the easiest way possible (and in no order)

1.) Grammar, etc: that is exactly why I asked for help.

2.) I meant wars a little less literal. For instance, anyone ever watch Judge Judy? Best friends, mother and daughter, etc, suing eachother over $100. We are falling apart when we really need to be sticking together.

3.) I am not trying to justify anyone's actions. I honeslty don't agree with them. I am just sharing my opinions, which I know are usually different from others, so in doing so I am hoping to help people look at things from another prospective.

4.) No, this was not bait. I honestly mean it, and I really don't want argument. Please recall that I am only 16.

--------------------
I haven't forgotten
and I won't forget
I just haven't gotten
around to it yet

You can call me Eternity :)

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uilleann
Discontinued


Icon 1 posted January 04, 2007 09:06            Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
For what it's worth, I realised you're serious, but did not have sufficient clarity of thought and belief in what I feel to be able to stand up against the level of attrition here that's now been brought to bear on you. And as I see it, you make some interesting and valid points and I do like where you're going with it, but I don't feel I could back myself up in an argument over it and decided to just keep quiet.

Geek Culture is like that. If you're lucky, you're respected. If you're not, you're either flat out ignored when you try to make a point, or ground down slowly by people. It's useless to resist: boo tried to fight the establishment and lost, as have others. I was always greatly dismayed by the way Shinaku was treated: age was never factored in, nor was any mercy offered. No-one deserves that, especially younger people who I believe will grow up better if they're at least treated with respect. There is no need to pretend they're better than they are to keep them sweet (be honest with people), but no reason to be deliberately obnoxious to them either.

I hope that Geek Culture one day learns to drop its hugely hypocritical snotty attitude that hides an emptiness of true community spirit or any true devotion to a geek or nerd lifestyle, and learns to embrace people more openly.

But as the years pass, I am not terribly hopeful. You may well find that this is just the wrong place to be.

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dragonman97

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Icon 1 posted January 04, 2007 09:36      Profile for dragonman97   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
You are one sick monkey.

--------------------
There are three things you can be sure of in life: Death, taxes, and reading about fake illnesses online...

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Stereo

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Icon 1 posted January 04, 2007 11:23      Profile for Stereo     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
NAW: I must admit I didn't read it all, mainly because I see a serious lapse in thinking. Both Hitler and Saddam were vengeful men. Vengeful people don't always gain such power (luckily), but they are all dangerous. Wether they tought (think, if you consider those of their like who are still alive) they were (are) doing the "right thing", their thinking is based on skewed data - and an overblown ego.

For example, a guy who didn't have the grades to go to the engineering school he was aiming for blamed the girls for "taking the men's place" - so one day, he went there and killed 14 women. IIRC, Hitler was in a similar situation, as he wanted to be an architect but couldn't pay (? - my memory is failing me), thus blamed those who had the money: bankers, who mostly were Jews. So he killed Jews. Saddam had to flee Irak (before ruling it) because his life was endangered by the people in power. When he came back... he killed them.

What allowed Hitler to gain power was that his sick ideas were taken as a solution for his people's problem. What allowed Saddam to gain power was... USA and other powers who wanted to get rid of the Irakian rulers in place then, so they trained him, gave him weapons, and let him lose. (Or that's what I understood, other more informed may want to correct that.)

[aside] I especially liked that piece of opinion I read yesterday about why Saddam was judged and executed for a rather minor mass assasination, causing the trials for the big ones to be canceled, because the latters would have put the US into hot waters.[/aside]

Still, I think Saddam shouldn't have been killed, for one simple reason: I value human life. And Saddam was human too. He did very bad things, but he was killed as a vengeance for his crimes, that were - as I stated before - vengeful killings. So on this stand, tell me the difference between Saddam and his judges? Not much beyond the number of death by their names.

So even though keeping Saddam alive allows the possibility of his liberation, even though many Irakians rejoiced over his death, and no matter how bad a man Saddam was, I still believe Saddam shouldn't have been killed. Simply because sometimes, justice isn't the same as righteousness, and I value the latter over the former.

uilleann: I see GC, among other things, as a place for ideas to be exchanged and debatted. If one can't defend his/her ideas properly, and can't stand being wrong, yes, they'll leave. But I will like someone whose ideas are shaky but who is open minded, and take this "fight" as an opportunity to improve. So yes, those who never learned to think by themselves and take everything they read/hear for gospel will get a beating. Wether they stay down or get back on their feet is up to them, though.

--------------------
Eppur, si muove!

Galileo Galilei

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Mel
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Icon 1 posted January 04, 2007 11:55      Profile for Mel     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I don't really think anyone should be comparing Saddam to Hitler, or anyone else. Personally, I don't think they have anything in common. Also, people have to realize that it isn't just a leader that kills - they have armies. Although we could say Hitler and Saddam are responsible for the deaths of many, soldiers have a choice whether or not to pull the trigger. There are a lot of evil minds behind these men.

...and then my tangent...

I've been hearing a lot about how Iraqis support the death of Saddam and how they support Bush's actions. In reality, just over half of Americans support the actions of Bush. Unless we all take a trip to Iraq, there is no way to tell how they really feel about all this.

I take the Humanitarian stance on this. This was simply an act of revenge. If we want to kill all murderers, who will kill the executioners? I will end this with some famous quotes to set this idea more in stone...

"Thou shalt not kill"

"Mankind must put an end to war, or war will put an end to mankind."

"Never think that war, no matter how necessary, nor how justified, is not a crime."

"It is forbidden to kill; therefore all murderers are punished unless they kill in large numbers and to the sound of trumpets."

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Sxeptomaniac

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Icon 1 posted January 04, 2007 13:30      Profile for Sxeptomaniac   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by never_ask_why333:
But if you really stop and think about it, is that not *exactly* what we just did to Saddam? We took it upon ourselves to judge what is 'right' and what is 'wrong'. But really, who are we to do that? Who are we, sinners, we all are (don't worry I'm not going into a religious thing). Who are we to decide who deserved life? Who are we to kill our own kind? But, to build on a point I only briefly touched-- we just did to Hussein what he did to others, and what Hitler did. We are hypocrits.

We judge right and wrong because we must. You are doing it in your essay. Those kinds of decisions also necessitate consequenses for doing wrong. What consequenses are appropriate and which individuals are best able to be fair and impartial is what we are left to decide, not whether or not we as a group have the right to judge.

Honestly, I haven't really decided whether capital punishment is ethical or not. Perhaps it's something that can only really be considered once a society has a certain level of development. After all, it wouldn't be feasible for many peoples in the world to confine a criminal for long periods, if they don't have the resources to do so.

quote:
Originally posted by Mel:
"Thou shalt not kill"

Keep in mind that is an old translation, from the King James Version. The modern translations are:

"You shall not murder." The New Revised Standard Version (NRSV)
"You shall not murder." New American Standard Bible (NASB)
"You shall not murder." New International Version (NIV)
"You must not murder." New Living Translation (NLT)
"You shall not murder." English Standard Version (ESV)

--------------------
Let's pray that the human race never escapes from Earth to spread its iniquity elsewhere. - C. S. Lewis

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ASM65816
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Icon 4 posted January 04, 2007 14:25      Profile for ASM65816   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
January 04, 2007 11:23
What allowed Saddam to gain power was... USA and other powers....

 -

"USSR", France, and China provided 80% of Saddam's weapons.

The US provided less than 1% of Saddam's weapons.   [Confused]

Does anyone believe Saddam gained power by selling his country's oil? Or was that a lie created by the CIA, and Iraq doesn't have oil and never did?

--------------------
Once a proud programmer of Apple II's, he now spends his days and nights in cheap dives fraternizing with exotic dancers....

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Sxeptomaniac

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Icon 1 posted January 04, 2007 14:50      Profile for Sxeptomaniac   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by ASM65816:
 -

Interesting graph, ASM, but 1975-1990 is what you would need to support your point, I believe.

--------------------
Let's pray that the human race never escapes from Earth to spread its iniquity elsewhere. - C. S. Lewis

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never_ask_why333
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Icon 1 posted January 04, 2007 17:37      Profile for never_ask_why333     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I'll try and address everything one at a time, as best as I can.

uilleann: I thought that this was very kind of you, and I thank you. I did not quite look at things this way. I also did realise that I was mostlikely going to be up against something bigger. I realize that every day. Among my daily life, I am just as opinionated as I am on here, and my opinions are just as....eccentric (for lack of a better word). So I am used to it. I do honestly thank you though. At least the majority of adults, unlike most kids, are not rude about it.
And as for Geekculture...I have every intention of carrying on just as I am. I will not disrespect anyone else, and if they do happen to disrespect me....oh well I guess.
And I was not looking for mercy about the age thing. I just wanted to remind you that the essay was not written be a super-genius college professor, but but a girl who is still in HighSchool.

dragonman: I will not even bother....

Stereo: I wish you had read all of it. I think my points became more clear (though not completely) as the essay went on. In reference to your reply, I think it may be appropriate (and might save some time) if I paste here something I had written to a friend who said something similar about my essay:

"You misunderstood me if you think I was agreeing with or justifying anyone's actions. My point was that while they did horrible things, we are doing just as horrible by sinking to their level.
I'm not sure about Saddam's intentions. Which is why I did not comment on them. I just used Saddam as my bridge to connect to other tyrants, namely Hitler.
But yes, opinion heard and respected 100%. Wasn't tring to argue here. I just realize that my opinions on most things are different from everyone else's, and that by sharing them, I can help others to look at things in a different way. And hopefully down the road as well. I think people should look at both sides, in the very least, before making any judgements about anything. "

I think that hits most of those points, Stereo. If I overlooked any, please let me know.

Mel: The first part of your reply, I will simply say look at what is in the paragraphs above this. I was not comparing the two. As stated, I was merely using Saddam as a link to get to Hitler (because Saddam was more recent, and we actually used the death penalty on him). As for the second part, I agree completely. Which, although not presented clearly (as said, this was basically a bunch of scribbled notes, not an essay, and not really even a first draft. I didn't know where to go with it so I was seeking help in bringing out the points), was actually one of my points.

Sxeptomaniac: I fail to see where i have judged. I tried to take a neutral point of view, by neither saying that Saddam was right/wrong, good/bad. The only 'judgement' I made was that humans should not be allowed to judge other humans, especially if it leads to death. In truth, I do not believe that humans are equipped to judge, and therefore they should not. I don't think it is up to us. I would expand on this, but going down the 'higher power/alien ruler' trip isn't really appropriate at this time.

And I agree with you on the chart AMS put up. Thanks, I actually didn't catch that at first.
But then again, I didn't really look closely at it, once I realized that it was only of (if any) little pertinence to this discussion.

AMS: Well, once again you have tried to prove someone wrong by using information out of context. I cannot say much to that....

And thanks to everyone.

Everyone has their opinions, and I am open to hearing and exploring them all. After all, how interesting would the world be if we were all alike?

Hope this covers everything. If not, just let me know.

--------------------
I haven't forgotten
and I won't forget
I just haven't gotten
around to it yet

You can call me Eternity :)

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ASM65816
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Icon 1 posted January 04, 2007 19:31      Profile for ASM65816   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
January 04, 2007 14:50
Interesting graph, ASM, but 1975-1990 is what you would need to support your point, I believe.

UN sanctions included a ban on the import of arms and dual-use items critical to the production of weapons of mass destruction. From 1991 to 2003, the SIPRI data shows no weapon imports to Iraq (which makes sense because governments selling weapons directly to Saddam after 1991 would be in violation of UN resolutions).

US "actual" deliveries of major conventional weapons to Iraq were from 1983 to 1988, with $125 million listed for 1988.

(In my opinion) SIPRI data after 1991 should probably be "unknown." In December 2000, Iraqi money transfers totaling $43.5 million had been traced to what Iraqi paperwork indicated as "a boiler system." The actual goods were discovered to be part of a $174 million Russian-made (1992) anti-aircraft missile system. It was investigated because it fit a money laundering pattern, and apparently delivery was halted as a result of the US preventing payment to the suppliers.

EDIT: Regardless of when support occurred, the combined support of USSR, France, and China was over 100 times what the US provided.

--------------------
Once a proud programmer of Apple II's, he now spends his days and nights in cheap dives fraternizing with exotic dancers....

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never_ask_why333
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Icon 1 posted January 04, 2007 20:19      Profile for never_ask_why333     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Regardless, ASM, I fail to see where this fits into the discussion??

--------------------
I haven't forgotten
and I won't forget
I just haven't gotten
around to it yet

You can call me Eternity :)

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freja42
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Icon 1 posted January 05, 2007 00:46      Profile for freja42     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
While I will not defend either Saddam or Hitler for what they did, I will never think that a death penalty is the right solution.
Humans or governments should not have the right to decide who deserves to die, which btw is a strange saying. Deserving to die?

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Ashitaka

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Icon 1 posted January 05, 2007 03:42      Profile for Ashitaka     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by freja42:
While I will not defend either Saddam or Hitler for what they did, I will never think that a death penalty is the right solution.
Humans or governments should not have the right to decide who deserves to die, which btw is a strange saying. Deserving to die?

Let's restate that. I think we can say if a crimminal deserves to die for a crime but we have no right to inforce the death.

--------------------
"If they're not gonna make a distinction between Muslims and violent extremists, then why should I take the time to distinguish between decent, fearful white people and racists?"

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Stereo

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Icon 1 posted January 05, 2007 04:20      Profile for Stereo     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
At tihs point of the discussion, I feel compelled to quote from Gandalf: "Deserve to die? Of course he does. Many people that live deserve to die and many people that died deserve to live. Can you give them their life back? So don't be so quick to give death." (Or something along. A translation from hazy memory of a translation can't be accurate.)

--------------------
Eppur, si muove!

Galileo Galilei

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Ashitaka

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Icon 1 posted January 05, 2007 05:30      Profile for Ashitaka     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
There are definatly people here that are in favor of the death penalty and those against. I wonder though how the lines are drawn. Specifically, how many people live in a country with capital punishment but are against it and how many people live in a country without capital punishment but are for it?

I wonder this because the lines for and against capital punishment seem to be drawn along wether ones state allows this sentence or not.

--------------------
"If they're not gonna make a distinction between Muslims and violent extremists, then why should I take the time to distinguish between decent, fearful white people and racists?"

-Assif Mandvi

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uilleann
Discontinued


Icon 1 posted January 05, 2007 06:30            Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
In every person is potential, tapped or untapped, and it's a loss to take away their life and waste everything that they could have been. (Although most societies do a spectacularly bad job of embracing human potential.)

The question that arises first for me is how much money and effort should a society spend on criminals? It wouldn't be an issue if society was smooth running and crime levels were low, but this is no longer the case and we have more miscreants than we can decide what to do with them, and no idea what to do with them.

I don't really believe that any crime is truly punishable by death, but if we as a society cannot help them, then what good does locking them up in a jail cell for years to come? People paid for the offenders' crimes not only as victims and now again as taxpayers. If you let them out you risk reoffence, and if you leave them incarcerated for the rest of their life, it's a waste of money.

Execution is one solution. Miscarriages of justice aside, it gets the message home of intolerance to crime and solves the problem of what to do with the perpetrator.

There are many people who you might instinctively feel deserve to die for what they did. Is there any hope for them if we don't kill them? If we cannot guarantee their redemption (and right now, we simply cannot), what is served by keeping them locked up for decades to come?

That said, most of crime is so badly handled both in terms of causes and attempted solutions, that if we looked after our society and brought crime down to where it should be: infinitesimal, then it would do no-one any harm to lock up the people who are truly disturbed while trying to help them become someone better.

But in a society that has gone so badly wrong as most have these days, what can we do?

And no, I don't feel that the death penalty can be carried out by a society that is so judicially and morally corrupt as it is the ultimate hypocrisy.

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Stereo

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Icon 1 posted January 05, 2007 06:46      Profile for Stereo     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
naw: True we do share some ideas. What I object to is the followoing part:

quote:
Originally posted by never_ask_why333:
His mission in life --and the cause of all the horrible things in his life-- actually started out as good intentions, that merely got lead astray. Unlike so many people today (yes, including many of our 'rulers'/authorities) his initial motivations were not to better himself, gain power, etc. He wanted to help the world, to make it a better place, to get rid of what he believed was polluting it...

I just noted that this particular view is most unexact (in my own understanding of events), then went on to expose my own vision on the whole thing. So although we may agree on the conclusions, the path that led to them seems to be quite different.

--------------------
Eppur, si muove!

Galileo Galilei

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Sxeptomaniac

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Icon 1 posted January 05, 2007 10:42      Profile for Sxeptomaniac   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by never_ask_why333:
Sxeptomaniac: I fail to see where i have judged. I tried to take a neutral point of view, by neither saying that Saddam was right/wrong, good/bad. The only 'judgement' I made was that humans should not be allowed to judge other humans, especially if it leads to death. In truth, I do not believe that humans are equipped to judge, and therefore they should not. I don't think it is up to us. I would expand on this, but going down the 'higher power/alien ruler' trip isn't really appropriate at this time.

"I do not believe that humans are equipped to judge" is a judgement. You are making a decision about what people should not do.

We have to make those kinds of judgements because, when we live connected to other people, their behavior impacts us, just as ours does the same to them. We need some kind of rule of behavior, even if that is only "you can't judge". One could only conceivably avoid making judgements only by avoiding all contact with other people.

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Let's pray that the human race never escapes from Earth to spread its iniquity elsewhere. - C. S. Lewis

Posts: 1590 | From: Fresno, CA | Registered: Mar 2005  |  IP: Logged
Mel
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Icon 1 posted January 05, 2007 12:23      Profile for Mel     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:

quote:
Originally posted by Mel:
"Thou shalt not kill"

Keep in mind that is an old translation, from the King James Version. The modern translations are:

"You shall not murder." The New Revised Standard Version (NRSV)
"You shall not murder." New American Standard Bible (NASB)
"You shall not murder." New International Version (NIV)
"You must not murder." New Living Translation (NLT)
"You shall not murder." English Standard Version (ESV)

Hope I coded this right...bah.

The term "murder" has many definitions, which include:

"to kill or slaughter inhumanly or barbarously"

Which can also be a matter of opinion. Some people thought the hanging was a humane way to die, and some don't. I personally don't see hanging by my neck as a pleasant way to go. But then again, I can't think of many pleasant ways to die anyways. The act of killing another, to me, is a horrible act in itself, whether it is done in a humane fashion or not.

The problem with punishment is that it is all based off of opinion of what works. Studies prove many different things on capital punishment, which just proves to me that maybe we need a new option altogether.

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littlefish
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Icon 1 posted January 05, 2007 12:31      Profile for littlefish   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I don't want to get caught up in this (after all, the best thing about the internet is choosing who not to argue with), but there is an interesting view from a very intelligent man here.
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TheMoMan
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Icon 1 posted January 06, 2007 11:17      Profile for TheMoMan         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Hi All________________When a State executes it removes a person from the gene pool and stops that person from being a repeat offender. However if the State errored then the judge and the jury have blood on their hands. I live in a State that outlawed Capital Punishment, and ever few years some one will bring up the idea of reinstating same. Would any of you sit on a jury to judge a person if you knew that the outcome could be Capital. I know that I do not have the wisdom of Soloman. I had a coworker who sat on a jury say that he was not convinced that the judged did the crime, but that he wanted him off the street anyway.

So did Iraq do the correct thing? I believe not, I feel that they made a colosal mistake, one the timing just before a holiday, allowing Cell Phones into the gallows area, and the unproffesional manor the execution was carried out. Now they have a bigger problem, all of the bad will.

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Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.


Benjamin Franklin,

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