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Author Topic: Should you post in old threads?
Ashitaka

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Icon 1 posted October 24, 2006 13:30      Profile for Ashitaka     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Should you post in old threads?

Poll Information
This poll contains 1 question(s). 14 user(s) have voted.
You may not view the results of this poll without voting.

Vote Now     View Poll Results


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Sxeptomaniac

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Icon 1 posted October 24, 2006 14:22      Profile for Sxeptomaniac   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I don't think it's a definite "yes" or "no", but I do believe it should be avoided, unless there's a good reason otherwise. Threads are a bit like conversations, so, for comparison, what would you think if a person were to bring up a conversation from a month or two ago, out of the blue, just to comment on how cool something was:

Al: "Hey man, remember that conversation between you and Chris last month where you said... and Chris said... and then you said..."
Bob: "Yeah, what about it?"
Al: "That was cool!"

On the other hand, if there's been a new development, or some significant insight, then there may be good reason to revive the conversation.

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Stereo

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Icon 1 posted October 24, 2006 14:35      Profile for Stereo     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Sxeptomaniac: totally seconded.

Ashitaka, I've never tried myself, but if you can, could you add an option "No, but exceptions are allowed" or something along? Without it, I can't vote.

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Eppur, si muove!

Galileo Galilei

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boo
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Icon 1 posted October 24, 2006 14:50      Profile for boo     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Well, I'm not allowed to vote but I'll just comment in here by saying this. Sure, why not? What's the big deal? Especially for someone new to the board who hasn't been in the conversation, before. If it's THAT big a deal to people that threads should die, then remove them or lock them so further comments can't be made.
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TMBWITW,PB

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Icon 1 posted October 24, 2006 14:54      Profile for TMBWITW,PB     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by boo:
If it's THAT big a deal to people that threads should die, then remove them or lock them so further comments can't be made.

Your average forum user can't do either of those. Even Superfans™ can't do it. Those powers are strictly reserved for the Benevolent Dictators themselves.

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boo
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Icon 1 posted October 24, 2006 15:10      Profile for boo     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Well that's what I meant, of course. If the admins don't want people to continue posting, it seems they would remove or lock the thread. [Confused] I don't know. It just seems logical to me.
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MacManKrisK

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Icon 1 posted October 24, 2006 16:54      Profile for MacManKrisK     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Boo: as people have kept saying, over and over and over again, *sometimes* there are reasons to add to an old thread, if you have something *meaningful* and *insightful* and *relevant* to add to the thread. If we had a thread locking policy around here, those rather rare circumstances would be circumvented, and that would cramp our open-minded thoughtful culture that we like to harbor around these parts.

I know you say that the "no necroposting" rule doesn't make sense to you. Along the same vein, speed limits don't make sense to me (it's been proven that you have less accidents the faster you go, but the few you /do/ have are more severe), but I still get ticketed when I don't obey them.

We're not going to start locking our old threads just because one n00b (read: you) thinks we should, no more than the state of Michigan is going to abolish it's speed limit just because I think they should. It's just not how we do things around here. Look around you... no one here posts in almost every thread, we don't try to dazzle people with our post count, hell, around here that wouldn't impress anyone anyway! Geeks, which the vast majority of us here are, are not impressed by external expressions like the quantity of posts accumulated; we are impressed by the content of them, by their quality.

I hope you stick around, boo, I really think you have some good geek potential, but if you want to live in our community, you need to live by it's rules just like the rest of us.

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get rich and you still die"


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boo
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Icon 1 posted October 24, 2006 17:07      Profile for boo     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by MacManKrisK:
Boo: as people have kept saying, over and over and over again, *sometimes* there are reasons to add to an old thread, if you have something *meaningful* and *insightful* and *relevant* to add to the thread. If we had a thread locking policy around here, those rather rare circumstances would be circumvented, and that would cramp our open-minded thoughtful culture that we like to harbor around these parts.

I know you say that the "no necroposting" rule doesn't make sense to you.

But by whose definition do you define, *meaningful, insightful, relevant?* There again you go with the "rules." You geeks sure wouldn't know how to get through the day without a giant list of rules to follow. [Big Grin] Surely you realize there are a variety of opinions that make the world go round.

And as for open-mindedness .. I would say that interpretation is far, far, farrr from being openminded.

Despite having posted on numerous boards over the years I have never heard the term "necroposting" used before. Maybe it's a geek thing? Anyway, now I know what it is. But again, I don't feel particularly limited by the idea that some (maybe most) of you frown on it. I'm honestly not trying to ruffle any feathers, just stating my point of view.

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ishy
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Icon 1 posted October 24, 2006 18:40      Profile for ishy     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Also being a noob, to this forum at least, and having just read the other thread where this discussion is raging, I think I will also give some perspective from a newbie's perspective. I've been doing mostly reading and no posting, so while I may not have a 'worthy' post count, I can already see some patterns emerging on this site.

My greatest suggestion would be to make some of the 'unofficial' rules 'official' rules as I happen to agree with boo that some of this community's unspoken rules are out of the ordinary when compared with other forums. That would be much simpler than locking threads, especially the way this forum is set up to ignore older threads.

I haven't heard the term 'necroposting' either, and am slightly confused as to the definition. Does it mean that you post a few words to rez old threads only, or in any thread? Clarification of the term might be helpful for the average noob. There are many forums, my site included, where random posting is allowed and even encouraged. There are also many that are not, but most of those have that clearly outlined for the newbie.

As for the issue of resurrecting old threads, I think I agree that it seems kinda silly to get so upset over, although I can agree that maybe if an old thread is resurrected, it be done for a reason ie. a thoughtful post. The way this forum looks at rez'ing old threads is unique, though. I have never been on a forum (in at least 100) where posting to an old thread was a problem. If that is an issue here, then maybe it should be noted where new people can read it.

A minor comment I have about the old threads here is that some of the categories I looked in old had 3-4 threads listed for the past 60 days, and so I kind of wondered if they were dying, and I ended up changing the view to the past year then found threads with topics in which I was actually interested. This made me want to comment in them.

My last comment is that while boo might across a little abrasive, some of the responses did come across rather critical and/or, honestly, more than a little arrogant. And I've seen several responses that made it very apparent that they did not care whether they got more new people or not. I've seen more forums die this way than any other. As I said, some of your forums don't look very active. It looks to me like you might need fresh blood more than you think.

This isn't necessarily a critique on the forum owners, as I have not seen their responses to these issues. My only suggestion for them is to post clearer forum rules, as the community seems to take their unofficial rules rather seriously. The rest of this post is directed at those answering these threads directly.

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Stereo

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Icon 1 posted October 24, 2006 19:07      Profile for Stereo     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Ishy: but if we made "unofficial" rules "official", how would we spot the bad newbies from the good ones? [Big Grin] But more seriously, to have official rules means to enforce them. GCers have been (mostly) able to behave themselves, and setting rules would be putting limits we don't need as a collectivity.

Now about the necroposting: it comes from greek "nekros" - death, and posting. It's resurrecting threads, simple as that. If you have something meaningfull to add to a thread, we're open. Giving a new life to a conversation can be nice, but just poking it isn't. Another option, if you really want to add something about a subject, would be to start another thread and link to the old. This way, people who want to read it again can, and those who remember it don't have to. A smart mind can find solutions.

Yes, some areas are quieter than others. Which ones can change over time. There's nothing wrong with that. The suggestion part, for example, isn't used unless there is a problem. For it to be almost empty only means that everything is well, but it's still needed every now and then.

And don't take us wrong. We can be very nice to newcomers, and they _are_ welcome. But some people's behaviour spells nothing but trouble, and we don't welcome trouble. You just happened to see the effect of that.

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Eppur, si muove!

Galileo Galilei

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ishy
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Icon 1 posted October 24, 2006 19:17      Profile for ishy     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I read Greek rather well, so I know what "nekros" means, however, I got the impression that not even all of your 'oldbies' understood from where the word derived and there were several different interpretations of it. And as far as some of the responses seeming kind of arrogant to newbies, I did not just note that in the two threads relating to boo, but in others as well. I also read several comments by older members who said that they were bothered by it sometimes. The "grow a thick skin" comment in particular was rather harsh and honestly, made me want to retreat to my nice, safe home. Being that my forum is 98% female, sometimes I like to read guys opinions and so I was wandering around here.

**I still hold that the unofficial rules be posted as official rules even if it's not the forum owners enforcing them, because obviously a lot of other people are enforcing them on newbies. If they aren't going to be posted as official rules, then perhaps everyone else should lighten up.

(Edited to add **)

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Sxeptomaniac

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Icon 1 posted October 25, 2006 00:44      Profile for Sxeptomaniac   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by ishy:
I read Greek rather well, so I know what "nekros" means, however, I got the impression that not even all of your 'oldbies' understood from where the word derived and there were several different interpretations of it.

You're right about that, though the word does have usage outside this forum. Each community will tend to have a different view as to whether or not necroposting is acceptable, and to what degree. All forums have different variations of netiquette. That's why it's considered a good idea to lurk a little in order to observe what's the norm. Within each community, there will be some more annoyed by breaches than others, and those with different pet peeves.

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Let's pray that the human race never escapes from Earth to spread its iniquity elsewhere. - C. S. Lewis

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Serenak

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Icon 1 posted October 25, 2006 08:47      Profile for Serenak     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
When in doubt I find it best to simply refer to this instructive video

[Big Grin]

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"So if you want my address - it's No. 1 at the end of the bar, where I sit with the broken angels, clutching at straws and nursing my scars..."

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ishy
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Icon 1 posted October 25, 2006 08:59      Profile for ishy     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Well, that video would actually contradict this forum's idea of necroposting. There were a couple of people who recommended "Don't post to an old thread - start a new one", which would be completely opposite netiquette on almost all other forums. And I submit this as something that may be even a point of disagreement or misunderstanding on the definition of necroposting among your older members.

Second, as for 'Well, just read the forums and you'll get all these rules', I would disagree. The necroposting issue I would not have guessed if I hadn't joined this forum yesterday as opposed to a couple of weeks ago. Some of these things are not so clear.

A short comment - the introduction forum is a bit easy to miss way down at the bottom of the forum, and it doesn't really look that active to a new person's perspective, so that might be something else that's missed.

A comment as an admin of several very large communities - it is possible to correct people, not sound arrogant, and not put down newbies so they will never come back. For every newbie you condescend to, there are probably 5 who have not joined or posted and who will never do so after reading some of the responses. So far, your admin Snaggy seems to have the ability to correct without being condescending and some of you who think it's your job to patrol could take some lessons.

I would think it would be rather easy to write up a netiquette guide, even if one of the non-admins wrote it to save the admins time, with the admin just checking it for errors and then stickying it.

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dragonman97

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Icon 1 posted October 25, 2006 09:12      Profile for dragonman97   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Fine, I shall hereby let someone whip me with a Cat-5 o'9 tails - just so long as it's not Zorro. I apologize for causing any great disturbance by what I thought was an innocent post. I never intended to provoke such a flurry of discussions about 'rules' or assaults on personal character.

boo, please post as much or as far as you care to. Please do not read anywhere in any message of mine that 'I shouldn't post about this' - utter bollocks! I'm sorry if I offended you somehow - peace?

If I managed to offend anyone else here, I'm equally sorry. There's a fresh pot of coffee in the back, help yourself! [Smile]

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Stereo

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Icon 1 posted October 25, 2006 09:50      Profile for Stereo     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by ishy:
I would think it would be rather easy to write up a netiquette guide, even if one of the non-admins wrote it to save the admins time, with the admin just checking it for errors and then stickying it.

But what if we don't want to? What if we like our anarchy (as in people behaving themselves so that no rules is needed - not the bastardized meaning of free-for-all)? Official rules were never needed before, and I don't want this to change. I took off the rules I wrote, and I'm sorry I wrote them it in the first place. My apologies to everyone.

(But dman, as far as I'm concerned, your mea culpa is unnecessary. Put your shirt back on, will you? [Big Grin] )

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Eppur, si muove!

Galileo Galilei

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uilleann
Discontinued


Icon 1 posted October 25, 2006 10:38            Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Necros is Andrew Sega. Nuff said.
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Ugh, MightyClub
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Icon 1 posted October 25, 2006 10:56      Profile for Ugh, MightyClub     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by dragonman97:
Fine, I shall hereby let someone whip me with a Cat-5 o'9 tails

To which Stereo responded:
(But dman, as far as I'm concerned, your mea culpa is unnecessary. Put your shirt back on, will you? [Big Grin] )

No way, Stereo. Once you've opened the port to a fresh round of puns there's no going back.

That said, I agree that apologizing for a fairly innocent post should not be necessary. But given the avalanch it unintentionally precipitated, I think it was the right thing to do. Hats off to you, dman. (Now where the heck did gg's hat-tipping smiley get off to?)

Now can't we all just get along?
</sniffle>

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Ugh!

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RScottV

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Icon 1 posted October 25, 2006 10:59      Profile for RScottV     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Serenak:
When in doubt I find it best to simply refer to this instructive video

[Big Grin]

Thanks! I LOVED that.
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Sxeptomaniac

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Icon 1 posted October 25, 2006 12:31      Profile for Sxeptomaniac   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Stereo:
quote:
Originally posted by ishy:
I would think it would be rather easy to write up a netiquette guide, even if one of the non-admins wrote it to save the admins time, with the admin just checking it for errors and then stickying it.

But what if we don't want to? What if we like our anarchy (as in people behaving themselves so that no rules is needed - not the bastardized meaning of free-for-all)? Official rules were never needed before, and I don't want this to change. I took off the rules I wrote, and I'm sorry I wrote them it in the first place. My apologies to everyone.

(But dman, as far as I'm concerned, your mea culpa is unnecessary. Put your shirt back on, will you? [Big Grin] )

Agreed, Stereo. I initially thought about advocating for posting a guide to our version of netiquette, too, but it struck me as ultimately a bad idea for a few reasons:
  • These are community standards of etiquette, not rules. As a result, sufficiently codifying them would be very difficult. As has been mentioned with necroposting, we don't have specific rules as to when it's appropriate, only that there be a good reason for it, and it not be done too often.
  • Writing them down tends to discourage change. Since these are community standards, and not rules established from above, there can, and probably will be, shifts in overall opinion over time.
  • Rules spawn lawyers. It's not unusual to find people who consistently follow the letter of the law, yet flagrantly violate the purpose of the rules. When confronted, they generally insist they aren't breaking any rules, and accuse the person who confronted them of breaking rules.


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Let's pray that the human race never escapes from Earth to spread its iniquity elsewhere. - C. S. Lewis

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dragonman97

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Icon 1 posted October 25, 2006 12:47      Profile for dragonman97   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Stereo: I'll only do so because the sight was probably making a few folks sick. [Wink]

Now then, did someone say something about puns?

Sounds like a plan!

(Unfortunately, I can't think of any right now. :-/)

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GameMaster
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Icon 1 posted October 25, 2006 13:06      Profile for GameMaster   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I think that if you have something new or oringal to add to an old thread, then necroposting it is alright; on the other hand, digging up an old post to say "me too", to flame or to troll is a "no no".

The few exceptions are, to necropost are "what are you listening to now", "Ask XYZ" where XYZ can be a number of members, and any political converstaion that has contributions by ASM...

That is my 2cents worth, at least.

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stevenback7
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Icon 1 posted October 25, 2006 14:46      Profile for stevenback7   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Now for my 2 cents,

I have to agree with some of you that i dislike necro posting. For the main part that most people's commments even if relavent or just an update aren't worth the topic to be ressurected or even read again. There is a reason why topics die out and that is because people just have nothing to say anymore. So if you missed your chance to post then don't post a year later voicing your opinion when the topic has long gone up to silicon heaven.

As for discouraging new members about the way people post. My answer is that this is a community forum and some people just don't fit into this community. And personally i don't want to have hundreds of people activelly posting topics because then it would be impossible to get to know people and be able to follow the forums. I've been away for the forums from the last week and it is all ready hard to read everything i missed.

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HalfVast

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Icon 1 posted October 25, 2006 14:54      Profile for HalfVast     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I just about always post in old threads and I don't see anything
wrong with it. We can't all be good little consumers and always
post in new threads just because some people think that's the
proper way to do things. Hell, I'm posting right now in a sweat-
shirt that's at least 16 years old. Don't even ask about the jeans
I have on.

Can't post in old threads... sheesh!

Posts: 795 | From: In the mitten around the abductor pollicis brevis. | Registered: Jan 2005  |  IP: Logged
boo
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Icon 1 posted October 25, 2006 21:00      Profile for boo     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Serenak:
When in doubt I find it best to simply refer to this instructive video

[Big Grin]

[Big Grin] [Big Grin] Helpful ..
quote:
Originally posted by dragonman97:
Fine, I shall hereby let someone whip me with a Cat-5 o'9 tails -

Dragonman97, please don't think I was angry with you or that you started anything. In fact, I answered your orginal post shortly after you wrote it and if you'll read it I'm sure you'll see that I answered you with humor. I only got bent out of shape when it seemed that everyone had something negative to say.

And btw, if I were to whip you, I'm sure you'd like it. [Big Grin]
quote:
Originally posted by Stereo:
quote:
Originally posted by ishy:
I would think it would be rather easy to write up a netiquette guide,

But what if we don't want to?
I hope I can say this without it being construed as troublemaking. Stereo, I would say, fine. But if that's really the concensus of the board, then please be more understanding when newbs inadvertantly break your rules. Most boards do post a set of rules or guidelines that they ask members to adhere to. But if you don't have such a posting, it's unfair to expect people to psychicly know what you want.

And just a thought: I may be a newbie here, but I'm not a newbie to forum message boards. I've been a member at the megaboards that have literally thousands of members, and I've been a member at smaller boards, such as this. As an oldbie at the smaller boards, I usually send a pm to newbies. As you know, they tend to stick out like sore thumbs. I generally say something like, "Hi, I see you're new here, welcome, I hope you like it ... blah blah blah, and if you have any questions, feel free to pm me or _____(I provide a mod's name - because, often, a newbie doesn't even know who the mods are.) Personally, I think it's a kind and appropriate thing to do.

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