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Author Topic: What happened to MH370?
spungo
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Icon 1 posted March 19, 2014 15:13      Profile for spungo     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
The Sunday Sport newspaper knows where it is. It's here.
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Ashitaka

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Icon 1 posted March 19, 2014 16:57      Profile for Ashitaka     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by dragonman97:
quote:
Originally posted by Snaggy:
A Startlingly Simple Theory About the Missing Malaysia Airlines Jet

http://www.wired.com/autopia/2014/03/mh370-electrical-fire/?utm_source=nextdraft&utm_medium=email

Patrick Smith, of Ask the Pilot, seems to concur that it's a decent possibility:
http://www.askthepilot.com/malaysia-airlines-flight-370/

It does make a hell of a lot more sense - very much a Hanlon's Razor sort of answer.

Also, the thing that bugs me about a na'er-do-well explanation is that people should be coming out of the woodwork to claim responsibility as chief-baddies...and no one has done that.

Unfortunately this doesn't work with the ping data they have from the satelite. The two arcs would not be reached flying for that airport.

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TheMoMan
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Icon 1 posted March 21, 2014 07:41      Profile for TheMoMan         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Lets go with the on-board fire scene with cascading electrical failure. Systems are going off as their Circuit breakers trip. The engine reporting equipment is at the engines and only Coax to the antennas.

Now what we have is a very large private plane with some analog controls and indicators. Does that thing have a wet compass or a gyro-compass, was the crew still alive or was trim the only thing steering the plane? Winds aloft, were they all aboard a powered glider?

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Benjamin Franklin,

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Ashitaka

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Icon 1 posted March 21, 2014 17:44      Profile for Ashitaka     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by TheMoMan:
Lets go with the on-board fire scene with cascading electrical failure. Systems are going off as their Circuit breakers trip. The engine reporting equipment is at the engines and only Coax to the antennas.

Now what we have is a very large private plane with some analog controls and indicators. Does that thing have a wet compass or a gyro-compass, was the crew still alive or was trim the only thing steering the plane? Winds aloft, were they all aboard a powered glider?

I don't see a fire destroying avery system tht allows communication but saving every one needed for flying.. fire is too indescrimatory.

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Icon 1 posted March 21, 2014 18:50      Profile for Mr. Geek 2U     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Mr. MoMan & Ashitaka,

I remember about a decade or so ago that a private jet carrying a golf pro, Payne Stewart, and crew had a sudden decompression event that suddenly debilitated the crew and killed them by hypoxia. There apparently was little time to put on oxygen masks. The jet was flying from Orlando, Florida to Dallas, Texas. During the flight there was a sudden turn off course and the plane headed northwest for many hours. NTSB officials believe the turn was a reaction to the decompression, but the pilots very quickly lost the ability to fly. Fighter jets dispatched to escort the plane witnessed the unconscious crew and frost on the windows. The plane ran out of fuel and crashed in South Dakota, way, way, way off course. I thought about that tragedy when I heard that the plane went off course and became unresponsive. I can see where smoke could have rapidly poisoned all aboard, and yet the plane would not have been damaged enough to stop flying. The story from this pilot seems consistent to the Payne Stewart crash.

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TheMoMan
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Icon 1 posted March 21, 2014 23:13      Profile for TheMoMan         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Al Arabiya News

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Benjamin Franklin,

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TheMoMan
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Icon 1 posted March 25, 2014 10:34      Profile for TheMoMan         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
It appears that Rolls Royce Engines phoned home, Inmarsat who also provides high precision signals to John Deere Star fire GPS units, Tractors and Combines. Has deduced that the MH-370 Flight came down in the Indian Ocean.

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Benjamin Franklin,

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Ashitaka

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Icon 1 posted March 26, 2014 15:09      Profile for Ashitaka     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
which in my mind makes the mystery greater. Somehow it would be easier to belive teh the plane went north, but while it seems the plane went south, the logical peies of why the plane went south do not fit well together.

--------------------
"If they're not gonna make a distinction between Muslims and violent extremists, then why should I take the time to distinguish between decent, fearful white people and racists?"

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TheMoMan
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Icon 1 posted March 26, 2014 16:11      Profile for TheMoMan         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Well they knew where their Satellite was and what way it was travelling, then by looking at the Doppler shift they could deduce the direction of the plane. Not unlike how your dashboard GPS knows where it is from the timing signals from the GPS Sats.

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Benjamin Franklin,

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Icon 1 posted March 27, 2014 08:20      Profile for The Famous Druid     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Ashitaka:
which in my mind makes the mystery greater. Somehow it would be easier to belive teh the plane went north, but while it seems the plane went south, the logical peies of why the plane went south do not fit well together.

Plausible theory: Something went wrong, (maybe a fire, maybe the 'bad antenna mount' theory I mentioned earlier, maybe something completely else, we may never know) they turned the plane around towards the nearest available landing strip, then the pilots lost consciousness and the plane just cruised along on its last heading until it ran out of fuel.

Without the black box, we'll probably never know.
So what are the chances of finding the black box?

It's unlikely any substantial parts of the plane are still afloat after (almost) 3 weeks in the water.

The black box has a sonic beacon that starts when it hits water, and has batteries for 30 days, 2/3 of that time's already passed, so searchers will only cover a tiny fraction of the half-million square nautical mile search area before the batteries run out.

Which leaves a 'brute force' sonar search, in a poorly mapped area not far from Antarctica, with a big undersea volcanic range that will make spotting objects on the bottom damn near impossible.

Don't bet the rent on the black box ever being found.

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TheMoMan
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Icon 1 posted March 27, 2014 10:34      Profile for TheMoMan         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
During the Air France search, they towed the underwater hydrophone in many areas. Until the batteries would be known dead after exhausting many areas they went back to formally thought clean areas and found the big pieces. However the surface debris field was found right away.

Just one degree by one degree search is 3440 square miles, at 44. S or N

Something that bothers me is that my Private pilot friends and charter fishing boats on the Great Lakes must carry Eperbs, Shock or Water activated floating radio beacons, Why didn't this air plane have one?

BoatSafe.com


wmjmarine

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Benjamin Franklin,

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Snaggy

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Icon 3 posted March 27, 2014 13:03      Profile for Snaggy   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Apparently this plane did have several of the water-activated floating radio beacons. That would suggest to me that impact was severe enough to destroy them. A supersonic spiral-in from high altitude perhaps.

Did the Air France crash's floating beacons activate?

If this is a suicide/mass murder situation, then putting the plane into the southern Indian Ocean was a good way to hide the deed. Especially if the person doing it didn't know about the pinging engines.

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TheMoMan
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Icon 1 posted March 27, 2014 22:48      Profile for TheMoMan         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
MA has finally admitted that there were Lithium-Ion Batteries in the cargo hold.

This is like the flight in Fla a few decades back where O2 generating canisters were flown, caught fire and brought down an airliner.

Damn it hasmat and people should not be on the same air plane.

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Benjamin Franklin,

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Xanthine

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Icon 1 posted March 28, 2014 19:48      Profile for Xanthine     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by The Famous Druid:
Plausible theory: Something went wrong, (maybe a fire, maybe the 'bad antenna mount' theory I mentioned earlier, maybe something completely else, we may never know) they turned the plane around towards the nearest available landing strip, then the pilots lost consciousness and the plane just cruised along on its last heading until it ran out of fuel.

About a week ago, I read an article by a professional pilot postulating just that: there was an on-board emergency, almost certainly a fire (something about pulling buses, which would account for the loss of communication), the pilot did exactly what he was supposed to do and turn the plane towards the nearest landing strip, and then everyone passed out.

Without the data recorders we'll never know, but a fire and frantic efforts to deal with the situation strike me as the most parsimonious explanation.

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TheMoMan
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Icon 1 posted March 29, 2014 11:47      Profile for TheMoMan         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Hi All

During all of the reporting, I have been baffled by how often the news services get ocean searches wrong, Four foot swells are a like a mogul when skiing, what is on the other side? CNN is the funnest as they are devoting so much time to the story, and the supposed experts are even funnier.

Now enter the conspiracy groups and their theories, WhooBoy. Here's a good one.

PressTV.ir

Just what we need remotely piloted Air Liners (Drones)

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Benjamin Franklin,

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TheMoMan
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Icon 1 posted April 05, 2014 13:24      Profile for TheMoMan         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Well, Well, Well, The Chinese claim to have heard one chirp from the Black boxes, at 25S and 100E

Interesting Very Interesting.

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Benjamin Franklin,

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Ashitaka

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Icon 1 posted April 05, 2014 15:39      Profile for Ashitaka     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
https://www.google.com/maps/place/25%C2%B000%2700.0%22S+100%C2%B000%2700.0%22E/@-25,100,5z/data=!4m2!3m1!1s0x0:0x0

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Snaggy

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Icon 2 posted April 05, 2014 15:40      Profile for Snaggy   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I hope this is real, but does anyone else get the feeling the Chinese are just "finding" things just so they can say they found something?

Like those original satellite shots that turned out to be a mistake...

The Mysterious object that turned out to be a jellyfish... how [crazy] can you get, it was obviously a jellyfish from the footage.

and I saw footage of them netting another mysterious object... a Bull kelp. [Roll Eyes]

They could use someone who has spent a day at the beach!

Rant over.

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dragonman97

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Icon 1 posted April 05, 2014 15:46      Profile for dragonman97   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
The Times article said that the Chinese didn't want to say for sure that it was the black box as their tracker could be confused by a whale. How the hell does a device that pings an active radio transponder get a response from a whale? Whales just magically return pings at 37.5 kHz?

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TheMoMan
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Icon 1 posted April 05, 2014 17:24      Profile for TheMoMan         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Well I have heard two freqs mentioned in the news. The gear a Hydrophone. Special Microphone for under water. A real high gain Amplifier, Noise filters to block out the tow ships noise, and other circuits. Any part of the circuit could especially the Amplifier do a freq. Double In fact I have several Transmitters that use those circuits, they look like amplifiers. So a dolphin, Porpoise or whale could make a chirp that could pass the Mic. and then double in the amplifier and appear in the right place on the spectrum analyzer. However the fundamental would also show unless the bandwidth of the spectrum analyzer is too narrow.

One Chirp does not prove anything, however they did post the location so that other ships could sail to that position.

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Benjamin Franklin,

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TheMoMan
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Icon 1 posted April 06, 2014 07:21      Profile for TheMoMan         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
OMG. are you FREAKING POOPING ME. The gear that the Chinese are using is simpler than the Fish locator I have on my deck boat!

Then the OZ ship a few hundred Clicks away claims to have heard a ping.

NBC News.

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Benjamin Franklin,

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spungo
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Icon 1 posted April 06, 2014 19:41      Profile for spungo     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Has anyone else thought that the plane may have been heading for Perth -- with nefarious intent?

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Snaggy

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Icon 4 posted April 06, 2014 22:25      Profile for Snaggy   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
spungo: hmmm, I thought they might be heading for Perth, but didn't think about the nefarious angle. chilling
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spungo
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Icon 1 posted April 06, 2014 23:10      Profile for spungo     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I imagine Perth is quite vulnerable amongst Oz cities, if you come in low over the Indian Ocean below radar.

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The Famous Druid

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Icon 1 posted April 07, 2014 00:49      Profile for The Famous Druid     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by spungo:
I imagine Perth is quite vulnerable amongst Oz cities, if you come in low over the Indian Ocean below radar.

That bit of ocean is actually very closely watched, part of our multi-billion-dollar effort to keep a few dozen refugee boats per year from arriving on our hallowed shores.

You'd have a much better chance of sneaking in on the East coast, we're not so paranoid about our Pacific neighbors.

But I really doubt if it was a flying-bomb operation, if that was the plan, wouldn't it be easier to hijack a plane that was already destined for Australia?

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