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Author Topic: Osama bin Laden is dead
Xanthine

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Icon 1 posted May 01, 2011 16:28      Profile for Xanthine     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
American troops apparently surrounded and killed Osama bin Laden in a mansion in Pakistan today. Read about it.

My thoughts range from cynicism to relief. I thought he'd died a long time ago, to be honest, and the tapes were fakes made by other terror groups to scare us. But apparently I was wrong. The boogie man was alive all along. I wonder who the fear mongers will plaster up in his place.

This event, of course, does not fundamentally change modern terrorism. But this was a big and embarrassing loose end. It is good to see it tied.

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And it's one, two, three / On the wrong side of the lee / What were you meant for? / What were you meant for?
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The Famous Druid

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Icon 1 posted May 01, 2011 16:56      Profile for The Famous Druid     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Xanthine:
American troops apparently surrounded and killed Osama bin Laden in a mansion in Pakistan today.

Incredible!

They've been hunting the guy for nearly a decade, those who believed him alive (I didn't) imagined him hiding in a cave or goat-herders hut in some remote corner of Afghanistan or the wild 'tribal' no-go zones of Pakistan, and all this time he was sunning himself by the pool in a **mansion** less than an hour's drive from the Pakistani capital city.

Un-be-frakkin-lievable.

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If you watch 'The History Of NASA' backwards, it's about a space agency that has no manned spaceflight capability, then does low-orbit flights, then lands on the Moon.

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Xanthine

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Icon 1 posted May 01, 2011 16:59      Profile for Xanthine     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I'd be shocked if he'd actually been there the whole time - it would be unwise to park your ass for too long when people are hunting you - but I imagine there will be embarrassment a-plenty as more of the facts come to light. There certainly is some truth to that old adage that the best place to hide is in the plain sight. I wonder if part of the reason Pakistan and the US have been getting rather shirty with each other lately is because we've been getting serious and their shell games aren't working anymore.

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And it's one, two, three / On the wrong side of the lee / What were you meant for? / What were you meant for?
- The Decemberists

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The Famous Druid

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Icon 1 posted May 01, 2011 18:39      Profile for The Famous Druid     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
From Wikipedia...

quote:
Wikipedia article on Abbottabad:
The city is well-known throughout Pakistan for its pleasant weather, high standard educational institutions and military establishments...

..On May 1, 2011, U.S. President Barack Obama announced that Osama bin Laden had been killed in Abbottabad.[3] Karachi's Geo News had a few hours earlier described a helicopter crash and "heavy firing" on the evening of May 1 "near the PMA (Pakistan Military Academy) Kakul Road",

He was 'hiding out' in a mansion just down the road from the Pakistan Military Academy?

Spidey-sense is tingling here...

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If you watch 'The History Of NASA' backwards, it's about a space agency that has no manned spaceflight capability, then does low-orbit flights, then lands on the Moon.

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Xanthine

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Icon 1 posted May 01, 2011 19:16      Profile for Xanthine     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
My guess is something happened that caused the Pakistani government to let the US move in. Either that or bin Laden had an enormous pair of balls and they finally did him in.

When the book about this comes out I might even read it.

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And it's one, two, three / On the wrong side of the lee / What were you meant for? / What were you meant for?
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Ashitaka

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Icon 1 posted May 01, 2011 20:08      Profile for Ashitaka     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Pretty smart place to be hiding out. I bet we had to buy off some Pakistan officials though to get him. hsding out next to a US ally that doesn't like us is pretty smart.

If the US wanted me dead, best placeto hide would probably be i9n China, right next to a military base.

I wonder how long they thought he was there.


..at least he wasn't hiding out in a mosque.

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TheMoMan
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Icon 1 posted May 01, 2011 21:12      Profile for TheMoMan         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Hang on to your back packs, I fear that the power vacuum will or has been filled.

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Ashitaka

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Icon 1 posted May 01, 2011 21:41      Profile for Ashitaka     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
lets open a discussion:

Why was the body of Osama Bin Laden "buried at sea" befor the announcement of his death was made.

This leaves only the word of the US military, that they killed Osama, and conducted DNA tests.

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"If they're not gonna make a distinction between Muslims and violent extremists, then why should I take the time to distinguish between decent, fearful white people and racists?"

-Assif Mandvi

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TheMoMan
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Icon 1 posted May 01, 2011 22:05      Profile for TheMoMan         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Buried at sea??

Actually a good plan no need for a shrine.


http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/sohaib-athar-unknowingly-live-tweets-raid-osama-bin/story?id=13506941

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GrumpySteen

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Icon 1 posted May 02, 2011 01:08      Profile for GrumpySteen     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Ashitaka wrote:
lets open a discussion:

Why was the body of Osama Bin Laden "buried at sea" befor the announcement of his death was made.


Because it had to be buried within 24 hours according to Islamic law and finding a nation that wanted his grave site was probably impossible. Can you imagine a spot that would be more prone to vandalism, violence and general idiocy?

The US didn't need to create yet another opening for anti-American propaganda ("see, they violate our burial laws to ensure that our people go to hell"). The DNA test probably took longer than that, not to mention deciding how to present the news, writing speeches, etc. In the end, burial at sea was probably the least problematic choice.

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Xanthine

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Icon 1 posted May 02, 2011 02:26      Profile for Xanthine     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
What Steen said. The US is trying to show that it's beef with bin Laden was not a beef with Islam. Burying him in accordance with Islamic tradition is a way to send that message.

Can you even begin to imagine what sort of circus ground a land grave for bin Laden would be? We'd've run out the clock just trying to find a place to put him, never mind putting him there. The sea'll swallow anyone though, and, assuming he was dumped in international waters, there's no need for permission either.

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And it's one, two, three / On the wrong side of the lee / What were you meant for? / What were you meant for?
- The Decemberists

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dragonman97

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Icon 1 posted May 02, 2011 03:15      Profile for dragonman97   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I suppose the only little issue is making sure there were plenty of witnesses. Otherwise, yeah -- it's a damn good idea to respect traditions there.

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garlicguy

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Icon 1 posted May 02, 2011 04:40      Profile for garlicguy   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Gunga-ga-lunga!

Now what?

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I don't know what I was thinking... it seemed like a good idea at the time.

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GrumpySteen

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Icon 1 posted May 02, 2011 05:06      Profile for GrumpySteen     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
garlicguy wrote:
Now what?

Now we praise the effectiveness on the war on terror and increase funding to the TSA so they can put up checkpoints at malls and movie theaters and increase the number of testicles groped every day by at least 100x.

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garlicguy

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Icon 1 posted May 02, 2011 05:12      Profile for garlicguy   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Geez, Steen!

I wish you hadn't posted that. Now some bot will find it and will become policy.

If only the TSA had remote rural offices - then I could apply to grope good looking women whom I've not even been introduced to - sort of a life-long dream, you know.... [devil wand]

mg

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I don't know what I was thinking... it seemed like a good idea at the time.

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GrumpySteen

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Icon 1 posted May 02, 2011 05:16      Profile for GrumpySteen     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
garlicguy wrote:
If only the TSA had remote rural offices - then I could apply to grope good looking women whom I've not even been introduced to - sort of a life-long dream, you know.... [devil wand]

They would only let you grope men. The women are groped by other women. Not a bad job if you're gay and promiscuous, I guess, but it doesn't make up for all the BS about not letting them marry.

Unrelated to that, some guy is an instant celebrity because tweeted about the raid that killed bin Laden without knowing what was going on, but he probably won't be allowed to grope people either.

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Ashitaka

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Icon 1 posted May 02, 2011 05:20      Profile for Ashitaka     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by GrumpySteen:
garlicguy wrote:
Now what?

Now we praise the effectiveness on the war on terror and increase funding to the TSA so they can put up checkpoints at malls and movie theaters and increase the number of testicles groped every day by at least 100x.

You forgot about permenently suspending habeus corpus, because this justifies every lost right, every injustice done and every colateral death done in the name of [strike] Avenging 9/11[/strike] combating terrorism.

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-Assif Mandvi

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garlicguy

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Icon 1 posted May 02, 2011 05:23      Profile for garlicguy   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by GrumpySteen:
garlicguy wrote:
If only the TSA had remote rural offices - then I could apply to grope good looking women whom I've not even been introduced to - sort of a life-long dream, you know.... [devil wand]

They would only let you grope men. The women are groped by other women. Not a bad job if you're gay and promiscuous, I guess, but it doesn't make up for all the BS about not letting them marry.

Unrelated to that, some guy is an instant celebrity because tweeted about the raid that killed bin Laden without knowing what was going on, but he probably won't be allowed to grope people either.

...which is why you won't catch me tweeting...

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I don't know what I was thinking... it seemed like a good idea at the time.

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Ashitaka

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Icon 1 posted May 02, 2011 05:24      Profile for Ashitaka     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
slate answers burial at sea question.

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"If they're not gonna make a distinction between Muslims and violent extremists, then why should I take the time to distinguish between decent, fearful white people and racists?"

-Assif Mandvi

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garlicguy

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Icon 1 posted May 02, 2011 05:26      Profile for garlicguy   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Ashitaka:
You forgot about permenently suspending habeus corpus, because this justifies every lost right, every injustice done and every colateral death done in the name of [strike] Avenging 9/11[/strike] combating terrorism.

I wouldn't know about that. You would need to ask old Honest Abe and each of his successors down to and including the current occupant of the Oval Outhouse...

[ohwell]

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I don't know what I was thinking... it seemed like a good idea at the time.

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steampunkgrrrl
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Icon 1 posted May 02, 2011 07:41      Profile for steampunkgrrrl   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I woke up this morning and had to rub my eyes to make sure I wasn't seeing things.

And then I started thinking, as I am want to do that early in the morning, my brain racing with no kind of traffic cop before coffee.

Wouldn't it have been more effective to take him alive, in order to get information from him? (If he would have been willing to give it up in the first place.)

Secondly, the announcement of his death has more than likely started a power struggle internally in Al-Qaeda. That or someone's already been put in his place and we can expect repercussions.

I did notice that someone had posted his body was buried at sea? Does that sound particularly odd to anyone else? I don't know that much about Islamic tradition, so Mr. Grumpy does make a good point. Still, something just doesn't quite sit right about that.

Which makes me ponder thusly....our government is known for its secret operations, right? (Bear with me here...conspiracy theory is new ground for me.) What if we did capture him and are questioning him? What would be worse...Al-Qaeda knowing that we killed him and dumped him at sea (which somehow follows tradition, showing that we do have a sense of honor), or knowing that we're holding him hostage somewhere and grilling him as we speak? The mind wonders.

But, there's my two cents.

Oh...and Mr. Garlic....*thwap* Rest assured you will receive much worse for randomly groping ANY female. [Razz]

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garlicguy

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Icon 1 posted May 02, 2011 07:52      Profile for garlicguy   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by steampunkgrrrl:


Oh...and Mr. Garlic....*thwap* Rest assured you will receive much worse for randomly groping ANY female. [Razz]

Well I can DREAM, can't I?

And no need to call me 'Mister', not ever. gg will do fine.

Besides, not once in 41+ years of marriage could the Missus accurately say that I "missed her".


[Big Grin]
gg

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I don't know what I was thinking... it seemed like a good idea at the time.

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TheMoMan
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Icon 1 posted May 02, 2011 08:55      Profile for TheMoMan         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Well it appears that the hounds have found their quarry. I do not rejoice, I am not elated, however the job is done, and done well. I wish they had chosen a deeper part of the oceans, I do not want some one mounting a recovery operation.

I do not know why but yesterday afternoon I took down my windmill and put up "The National Ensign" in its place.

It does not matter if we had followed all of the tenets of Islam someone or some group would have been offended.

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Ashitaka

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Icon 1 posted May 02, 2011 09:31      Profile for Ashitaka     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by TheMoMan:
Well it appears that the hounds have found their quarry. I do not rejoice, I am not elated, however the job is done, and done well.

Well said...

I don't care what a person did, you shouldn't dance on a person's grave. ( which is what I think all these celebrants are doing.)

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-Assif Mandvi

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GrumpySteen

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Icon 1 posted May 02, 2011 09:38      Profile for GrumpySteen     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
"I mourn the loss of thousands of precious lives, but I will not rejoice in the death of one, not even an enemy." - Martin Luther King, Jr

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